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Scott  Horton

What Did Pelosi Know?

Nancy Pelosi Tim Sloan, AFP /Getty Images Republicans are using reports that the speaker was briefed on torture to turn around the debate and duck further hearings. The Daily Beast's Scott Horton asks: Will the tactic work?

Republicans are launching a counteroffensive as the torture debate heats up, trying to lower Democratic pressure for an official inquiry by claiming House Speaker Nancy Pelosi was implicated. Democratic congressional leaders, they insist, were briefed in detail and acquiesced to the Bush administration’s “enhanced interrogation techniques”—waterboarding, stress positions, hypothermia, sleep deprivation of up to eleven days and walling (slamming a prisoner’s head against a plywood wall. If Democrats want an inquiry, says former House Intelligence Committee chair, Representative Peter Hoekstra (R-MI), “The first people that should be called in and held accountable ought to be Congress.”

"The bottom line is she and her key staff, they all knew about it," Republican Congressman Peter Hoekstra says.

The Democrats, however, don’t see it that way. Speaker Nancy Pelosi, who served as ranking member of the House Intelligence Committee at times when Hoekstra chaired it, acknowledges briefings were held. But she says they covered only general information about the techniques that the CIA believed it had in its disposal, not specific reports that they had actually been used or its results. She also notes that given the secrecy required she was forbidden from discussing them with her staff or even other members of Congress.

On Thursday, ABC News broadcast a report derived from a summary that the CIA provided the Senate Intelligence Committee of the briefings furnished Congressional leaders at which the subject of torture came up: “House Speaker Nancy Pelosi was briefed on the use of ‘enhanced interrogation techniques’ on terrorist suspect Abu Zubaydah in September 2002, according to a report prepared by the Director of National Intelligence’s office and obtained by ABC News. The report, submitted to the Senate Intelligence Committee and other Capitol Hill officials Wednesday, appears to contradict Pelosi’s statement last month that she was never told about the use of waterboarding or other special interrogation tactics.”

Pelosi, however, stood by her account and insisted that the report had it wrong. ABC had just been reprimanded by the New York Times and other media critics for falsely reporting the intelligence value of CIA waterboarding in a feature story by Brian Ross. In that case, ABC rushed to the airwaves with a story from a CIA officer who it turned out had no direct knowledge. Subsequent publication of Justice Department documents proved the ABC story incorrect. Was ABC taken for a fall a second time?

Among the details that ABC initially omitted from its report was a particularly telling one. The CIA schedule did not rest on contemporaneous records, but rather an after-the-fact attempt by CIA agents to reconstruct what had happened. In fact, the intelligence officers weren’t so confident of their recollection of what happened.CIA Director Leon Panetta, in a cover memo, stated that the information supplied the Senate Select Intelligence Committee was based on “notes that summarized the best recollections of those individuals. In the end, you and the Committee will have to determine whether this information is an accurate summary of what actually happened.” And indeed, former committee chair, Senator Jay Rockefeller (D-WV), almost immediately pointed out that the CIA schedule had an obvious error—showing him as present at a briefing he did not attend.

The ranking House Republican on its Intelligence Committee, Peter Hoekstra, busy campaigning for governor of Michigan, is dismissive of a push for further hearings or a commission of inquiry on Bush-era torture policy, both moves backed by Pelosi. He insists that Pelosi’s claim she was not informed that the techniques were used are nonsense: “Clearly her left wing is outraged that waterboarding was used. The bottom line is she and her key staff, they all knew about it.”

At this point, what congressional leaders learned about the Bush interrogations program and how they reacted to what they learned is certainly relevant though not central to any inquiry, and Republicans can be expected to keep pushing the issue to center stage. In any case, Democrats, at the time, were in the minority without influence over the Bush administration’s decisions. Very little information is now available to the public. It is noteworthy that Pelosi states she joined in an objection that Representative Jane Harman (D-CA), who succeeded her as ranking member of the House Intelligence Committee, following a briefing in 2003. According to the new CIA chronology, that was the first briefing at which the subject of waterboarding was raised.

A source close to Pelosi says she has nothing to fear from further disclosures. “We welcome further development of the facts and a full inquiry,” he said. “Those pushing this story badly want to avoid just such an inquiry. Isn’t that telling?”

Scott Horton is a law professor and writer on legal and national security affairs for Harper's Magazine and The American Lawyer, among other publications.


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May 11, 2009 | 6:30am
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6:39 am, May 11, 2009

Dave1959

Just showing what some Dems are ... Hypocrites

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7:26 am, May 11, 2009

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8:23 am, May 11, 2009

Dave1959

True .. But then all of us do not hold a high office !!

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8:33 am, May 11, 2009

PRKL8R

If Bush, Cheney, Gonzalez, Rice, Rumsfeld, Yoo, Bybee, etc. were to be prosecuted and jailed for torture while Pelosi was shown to the whole world to be a hypocrite, that would be cool with me.

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12:56 pm, May 11, 2009

ncopas

OMG, wow.. "some Dems are hypocrites".. how insightful.
Well, how about this: most Republicans are hypocrites (who also happen to be racist, gun-toting, tyrannical, dangerously religious, narrow-minded, war-mongering, torturous, chauvinistic, self-indulgent scum who don't care at all about the welfare of our country or the world)

Cheers!

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2:42 pm, May 12, 2009

estcruzer

Please, make sure that generalizations are correct, I don't believe that most Republicans are ........ Probably not even most Republican Leaders are all of those things. But there are enough Republican Leaders like that to completely misrepresent those folks that call themselves Republicans and it doesn't help when the rest of us collapse the distinction between those Republican Leaders and the rest of the population of Republicans.

Be sure and "Blame" the right people if you really want to get something accomplished other than to vent.

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9:38 am, May 14, 2009

Ozone69

I think it boils down to whether the methods used were appropriate or not and if she knew about them and found them to be torturous she should have done something, anything to object. Frankly, I don't think that our intel gathering should be included in transparency in government. Leave that to the bailout bonuses and pork projects in the trillion dollar budget.

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11:49 am, May 12, 2009

PRKL8R

Whether or not "she knew about them" and "should have done something" is nothing but a diversion. That's exactly what the Bush people want you to focus on. Again, fine, torture supporters, after Bush, et. al. have been prosecuted and jailed for the actual crime of torture, go after Pelosi for "know[ing] about them." (While you're at it please refer me to the statute she has violated.) I would be completely happy to see that bluff called.

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3:02 pm, May 12, 2009

robjh1

She knew about everything and then some. How could she not? She is the Speaker of the House. Do you really think they could have gotten any by her? C'mon.

It a case of throwing the rock and hiding the hand.

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8:01 am, May 11, 2009

smitisan

Dennis Hastert was Speaker back then. Dems were the minority, Good grief.

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9:19 am, May 11, 2009

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12:05 pm, May 11, 2009

Munodi

robjh1 are you really that stupid that you don't now she was NOT the speaker of the house when this happened?
And regardless if she knew or not she didn't authorize Torture. She had NO power to do anything. It was classified info and it was against the law for her to speak about it. What a lame attept to try and blame Dems. for Bush Co. breaking of U.S. law.

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10:30 am, May 11, 2009

steff47

This is called republican disinformation get everyone worked up about nothing keep telling the noninformation over and over again and soon people will beileve the misinformation as truth

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12:35 pm, May 11, 2009

Farmer-Dave

Maybe Pelosi knew, maybe she didn't. If she did, was she in a position to do anything about it? Is knowing the same as doing (or authorizing)?

We need a bi-partisan congressional investigation on the entire torture issue.

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11:19 am, May 11, 2009

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12:05 pm, May 11, 2009

roger37

She says she was informed that the EIT's (Enhanced Interrogation Techniques) were in their list of "procedures," but not that they had been used. She said that she said that she was against their use.

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12:20 am, May 12, 2009

Banjo1

So the Obama administration has ordered various bureaucracies to say ABC was wrong. This keeps up and maybe the cheering from the press corps will die down. Nah, never happen.

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8:37 am, May 11, 2009

Munodi

More nonsense from Banjo our resident racist closet homosexual.

Keep up the good work you're doiing a great job of making yourself look like an ass.

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10:41 am, May 11, 2009

This comment has been removed by The Daily Beast's editors.

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11:17 am, May 11, 2009

Ritarita

Banjo-
Get the hell
Out of the
Closet.

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2:28 pm, May 11, 2009

Tango121

What it makes her is a liar!

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8:55 am, May 11, 2009

PRKL8R

And can't we all agree that lying is a much greater crime than torture? It's amazing she hasn't been given the gas chamber yet for the heinous crime of lying. What kind of country do we live in that a politician can get away with lying? "You're a killer." "Oh yeah? Well, you LIED!" We should stop putting torturers and killers in jail. Fill the jails with liars. That sounds like a smart way to run things. Congress should just drop everything right now and pass a law against lying because there's just way too many lies being told.

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3:12 pm, May 12, 2009

flyoverland

The Dems really need to push her to the side. She is a lightning rod and an extremeist who will stand in the way of real progress in the House.

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10:08 am, May 11, 2009

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10:37 am, May 11, 2009

Munodi

Bush authorized torture, spyed on Ameircans and started an unprovoked war and you call Pelosi an extremist? What kind of American are you?

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10:40 am, May 11, 2009

ncopas

thanks for pointing this out, seriously we had genocidal war criminals for a president and a vice president (basically modern Hitlers with an even firmer grip on the media) and Nancy Pelosi is an extremist.. interesting.

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2:46 pm, May 12, 2009

steff47

yes that's true but once they get in office they are hell to get out

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1:01 pm, May 11, 2009

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3:26 pm, May 11, 2009

ztower

Exactly why does the source for Pelosi make - "We welcome further development of the facts and a full inquiry," - sound so third party? Isn't she in a position to insist and and actually drive a congressional hearing into the matter?

Let's get on with it and let the chips fall where they may.

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10:55 am, May 11, 2009

mn-steve

Horton, being the good lawyer he is, is injected that wee bit of doubt that somehow Ms. Pelosi (his client) was not even present at the briefings. Unfortunately, the "after-the-fact attempt" shows multiple people corroborating the apparent fact that Ms. Pelosi did know about this and was, at the very least, culpable in the torturing of Mr. Zubaydah.

I say "bring it on." If you were directly involved with ordering this fiasco then you should go to jail (Mr. Cheney). If you were indirectly involved (Ms. Pelosi, Mr. Hastert, ...) you should be removed from Conress and not allowed to ever seek national office again.

What was done (the waterbording) is such a disgrace and so stupid that those responsible need, I say must, be held accountable.

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11:05 am, May 11, 2009

penscott

Pelosi was briefed, and is cynically denying it. So were lots of other Democrats.

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11:06 am, May 11, 2009

lmktacwa

All the more reason to get it all out there in the open. To shut UP the repube supporters and shut DOWN the repubes.

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11:17 am, May 11, 2009

oliverckerr

The fascist confuses realities. When the nazis stuffed all the Jews, and gypsies and gay people into box cars they were told they were being transported to work camps.

When the trains arrived at Auschwitz, it appeared to the weary travelers they were at a train station being welcomed by a quartet of prisoners playing Mozart. They were then lined up, in files of women and children and men, to have a shower.

My father was there. In CBS black and white file film, you can see my dad playing the piccolo instead of a flute, farthest on the right. By an accident of fate he survived.

I do not take any pride in being an expert in fascists, or the fascist style of doing business, but:

In each instance of torture, which 'water boarding" is torture, in spite of blabberific talking heads like Pat Buchanan who refuse to cross that threshold and state on TV they don't know that water boarding is torture. . . . so you have to waste time and energy on crossing the threshold . . . . water boarding is torture - sleep deprivation falls in the same category, and etc.

All of these (get ready for a fascist euphemism) "enhanced" interrogation techniques qualify as, over the line. These methods did not save any lives.

So, the issue for those people who approved and probably devised the "program," who developed the "process" was to cover their behinds. therefore Nancy Pelosi attends a top secret meting with CIA people who imply that 'enhanced" interrogation methods, (water boarding) are on the table and are being considered as being legal.

They don't come out and say they are doing it. Minutes of the meeting are not kept. And she is absolutely disallowed from even talking about what they told her.

We need a Special Prosecutor. That should be Jonathan Turley, the law professor from George washington University!

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11:23 am, May 11, 2009

penscott

You seem to dislike Fascism. Isn't it a one-party state with a charismatic leader and state control of large corporations? Seems like the US is there.

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1:10 pm, May 11, 2009

downbytheriver00


Oh man, I like that one! If the US ain't at that point yet then the State of Massachusetts certainly is!

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2:20 pm, May 11, 2009

oliverckerr

I believe in the two party system. One party should be registered voters and the other party unregistered voters. The main goal of the registered is to get the unregistered to participate, by voting.

The elections should be run by the unregistered because they do not have a vested interest in who wins.

Relative to the Independent Party (consisting of the registered), factions are good enough! This was George Washington's idea. Factions.

One faction supports a woman's choice. Another faction believes Roe v. Wade should be overturned. One faction believes in birth control. Another faction preaches abstinence. This is way more cost effective for the conduce of our public affairs then this sham pretense of two different main parties and all the feather bed duality that goes with it.

An examination of the public records over a couple decades will show the party in power, which ever one it is, spends the money like water to insure their reelection, and the party out of power preaches fiscal austerity. Those two positions are firm. The only change is the name of the party in power.

Barack Obama is not especially charismatic. He isn't. Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. was charismatic. Marlon Brando was charismatic. But Obama is energetic. These so-called political leaders (Hillary, Obama) are really bureaucrats. What distinguishes them from the bureaucrats you never see is their ability to read a speech. They are not leaders.

Obama's people are printing money 24/7 and a lot of this money is being funneled into corporations, but we are not controlling them. Soon a stick of Wrigley's chewing gum will sell for a dollar, and Mother Nature will raise the sea level 15 feet, flooding the first floor and every basement in Manhattan because she is getting tired of being raped by Money & Power all day every day, so from her point of view it's time to repossess Long Island and rename it Cod Land.

But I agree fascists confuse reality and we have a lot of people in medja and government who spend their days and nights confusing reality, so maybe we are there. Our politics are broken and we need to renew everything.

But just making this suggestion almost guarantees the Fascist Bureaucracy Ink (FBI) will set up a live telephone tap and put you on J. Edgar Hoover's party line. When you hear the echo know they are listening live.

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4:50 pm, May 11, 2009

roger37

We were closer to it under Bush. He was "charismatic" (at least to the average schmuck on the street that doesn't have the mental energy for critical thinking), the administration cronied with corporations (a key part of facism), and militarism was predominant. And a one-party system was one of the stated objectives of Goebbels, I mean Rove.

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10:19 pm, May 11, 2009

Plantagenet

The elderly Pelosi was briefed about the water torture, knew about water torture, signed off on water torture, and didn't object to water torture..

Pelosi covered up for torture then, and she is lying about her full knowledge of the EI/torture program now. Pelosi refuses to allow a bill to go through Congress that would outlaw waterboarding. For the good of the country, Pelosi should be impeached and removed from office immediately.

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11:52 am, May 11, 2009

Ritarita

If she's guilty
Then string her up
With the rest
Of them.
It's not a Left/
Right issue.
We lost a 200
Year reputation as
The good
Guys.

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2:32 pm, May 11, 2009

roger37

I agree completely, as would most "liberals". Therein lies the big difference between the libs and the conservatives. The Right Wing would talk themselves into supporting something as disgusting as torture, and the left wing won't.

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10:22 pm, May 11, 2009

blissfulight

Let's have a full examination of the facts. Clearly, if the Democrats have nothing to hide, it would be in their best interest to fully disclose their role in the briefings about torture. This is a not-too-subtle way at trying to make the Dems culpable in the torture, and scare them away from any potential investigation. What it actually has the unintended effect of doing is revealing that the Republicans have something to hide. Personally, I want full disclosure, a deep investigation, and prosecution of any and all that were involved in torture, and if it includes Pelosi, so be it.

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11:59 am, May 11, 2009

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12:01 pm, May 11, 2009

ThinkAgain

Playing dumb is a questionable strategy for a woman in power. Men get away with it but it's harder for women.

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12:56 pm, May 11, 2009

This comment has been removed by The Daily Beast's editors.

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2:03 pm, May 11, 2009

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5:57 am, May 12, 2009
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What Did Pelosi Know?

by Scott Horton

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