Blogs and Stories

Michelle Goldberg

The Pro-Life Insurrection

BS Top - Goldberg Abortion Alex Wong / Getty Images The killing of Dr. George Tiller yesterday is no surprise to abortion providers, who have been preparing for violence, says Michelle Goldberg. Is it the start of right-wing revenge?

Shortly after Barack Obama was elected, the National Abortion Federation sent out a security alert to its members asking them to be on guard. “We know from experience that political losses can sometimes incite antiabortion extremists to retaliate against abortion providers,” Vicki Saporta, the president of the NAF, told me in April. Antiabortion violence had ratcheted up during the Clinton administration, when radical pro-lifers felt themselves politically disempowered. “The first murder was in ’93, and in ’94 we had four murders," Saporta said. "Then again in ’98 we had two murders.” Antiabortion violence had declined since then, but she feared a reprisal.

“This is a teaching moment,” says Randall Terry, the founder of Operation Rescue. “We can talk about what a vile, evil man [Tiller] was, and discuss all the different ways that he killed children.”

And now it’s happened. On Sunday morning, Dr. George Tiller was assassinated in the lobby of his Wichita, Kansas, church. It was the first killing of an American abortion provider since 1998, and it was even more brazen than the shooting of Dr. Barnett Slepian in his suburban kitchen 11 years ago. The man arrested for Tiller’s murder, Scott Roeder, posted at least one comment on the Web site of the antiabortion group Operation Rescue suggesting that antiabortion activists attend Tiller's church en masse. According to local news reports, he had the group’s phone number on a Post-It in his car when he was arrested. He could be a lone lunatic, but he might also be part of a movement that’s reemerging after years of relative dormancy.

People who study right-wing extremism have been worried for months that something like this might happen. In far-right circles, “there’s a sense that America has tipped and has slipped out of control and somebody better do something, with regard to abortion, gay marriage, demographic changes,” says Brian Levin, director of the Center for the Study of Hate and Extremism at California State University, San Bernardino. Levin is a former cop who often consults with law enforcement. He studies all sorts of movements—neo-Nazis, jihadists, and fringe environmentalists. He has no political ax to grind. But he says that lately, the climate on the far right reminds him of that which prevailed in the mid-1990s—restless, apocalyptic, and ready for action.

Earlier this spring, conservatives went into paroxysms of outrage after a leaked report from the Department of Homeland Security warned of the possibility of right-wing violence. “Paralleling the current national climate, right-wing extremists during the 1990s exploited a variety of social issues and political themes to increase group visibility and recruit new members,” the report said. “Prominent among these themes were the militia movement’s opposition to gun-control efforts, criticism of free-trade agreements (particularly those with Mexico), and highlighting perceived government infringement on civil liberties as well as white supremacists’ longstanding exploitation of social issues such as abortion, interracial crimes, and same-sex marriage.”

Many ordinary right wingers accused the DHS of defamation, and, indeed, there’s reason to be wary when the government starts investigating ideologies. Nevertheless, the DHS was on to something. In the 1990s, amid economic instability and a sense that the president was an illegitimate traitor, a violent right-wing demimonde emerged. A few people connected to it turned to terrorism. Besides violence directed at abortion clinics and doctors, there was Eric Rudolph’s Olympic bombing and the Oklahoma City bombing. Now the economy is far worse, as is the degree to which conservatives find themselves marginalized in national politics. There’s desperation in the air.

That’s especially true with regard to abortion. “They see the mainstream antiabortion leadership as being traitorous or emasculated at best,” Levin says of the radical antiabortion movement. After all, Rick Warren gave the invocation at Obama’s inauguration. Notre Dame gave him an honorary degree and invited him to speak at commencement. A recent Gallup poll showed that, for the first time ever, more Americans identify as “pro-life” than “pro-choice,” but the antiabortion movement still can’t find momentum. “They feel like their leadership is not carrying the ball on this and has basically become patsies or traitors,” says Levin.

Meanwhile Tiller, known for providing late-term abortions, had been unbowed by the relentless campaign against him. Antiabortion protesters have long singled him out personally, as they did Slepian, demonstrating in front of his home as well as his clinic. In 1985, his clinic was bombed. In 1991, Operation Rescue laid siege to his practice before moving on to Buffalo, where Slepian worked. In 1993, Tiller was shot in both arms. Antiabortion activists brought a citizen-initiated grand jury investigation against him, accusing him of violating a law governing late-term abortions, but in March he was acquitted.

In this context, says Levin, Tiller’s murder is a call to action. “I think the assassin wanted to make a statement by killing him at a church, to say that the holy act was killing this guy and ending this hypocrisy and saving babies,” he says. “He wanted to do more than just kill someone he considers an evil baby killer, wanted to send a message to friend and foe alike that hopefully there will be more.” Tiller’s assassination looks like what anarchists and far-right groups alike sometimes call the “propaganda of the deed.”

Randall Terry, the founder of Operation Rescue, is unabashed in saying that the murder could help the antiabortion movement. “This is a teaching moment,” he said when reached by phone Sunday night. “We can talk about what a vile, evil man [Tiller] was, and discuss all the different ways that he killed children. Dr. Tiller was one of the most evil men on the planet. Part of my goal is I’m going to shore up pro-life leaders to not flinch, not fear, not waver.”

Indeed, as if he was following a script written by Levin, Terry complained about the timidity of his movement’s leadership, and said he was about to unveil a 14-part television series with the Latin title, Insurrecta Nex. “It means, ‘insurrection against the slaughter of innocent people,’” says Terry. Whether or not Terry knew about Roeder, he’s clearly gearing up for something.

Levin fears that, as in the 1990s, other attacks could follow. “One thing we know about extremism is that it tends to occur with some seriality,” he says. “This was not only a single assassination. Within the movement, it was a call to arms. Whether or not it’s successful, your guess is as good as mine.”

Xtra Insight: The Daily Beast's Max Blumenthal interviews Operation Rescue's Randall Terry.

Xtra Insight: The Daily Beast's Joe Stumpe: Tiller's Muder Was 10 Years in the Making

Michelle Goldberg is the author of The Means of Reproduction: Sex, Power and the Future of the World and Kingdom Coming: The Rise of Christian Nationalism. She is a senior correspondent for The American Prospect, and her work has appeared in The New Republic, The Nation, the Los Angeles Times, Glamour, and many other publications.


View as Multiple Pages
Back to Top
June 1, 2009 | 6:32am
Comments ()
kscr14

In the sick twisted mind of these extremist,do they ever consider the mom as the murderer?Murder is just wrong.Never the solution.Ever.

|
|
Reply
|
6:53 am, Jun 1, 2009
quick2no

You have the belief that the soul enters the body at conception and the mother should be killed instead? There are many of us that believe the soul enters the body at birth, the first intake of air to the child's body. It is with the mother's permission and love that life is given. So, your perception is simply a personal choice in the end. So is mine. A hate monger, tho, like Bill O-Reilly, who preaches his own brand of intolerance towards many so-called 'liberal' groups, has a special place in the hearts of the right wing extremists, people ready to kill to be 'right'. Hate mongers and their devotees are no different than foreign terrorists. The trouble is, we have them right on our soil, our own people. Your comment is part of the problem, not a solution. Intolerance is a seed of violence. Capital punishment does not work. The bible says, Thou Shalt Not Kill. Never the solution. Ever.

|
|
Reply
|
7:39 am, Jun 1, 2009
kscr14

With clarity I stated murder is wrong.In the twisted mind of anyone that commits murder over abortion I wonder if the mother is ever thought to be the murderer?To a sane person,murder is murder.Never the appropriate statement despite the reason.

|
8:34 am, Jun 1, 2009

This user is no longer registered.

|
10:18 am, Jun 1, 2009
hungryhungryhorus

Please list a citation with objective evidence for souls entering the body at birth as opposed to conception. Also, please cite objective evidence that "souls" actually exist. Until then, I will value your opinion with the same weight as the long-dead bronze age goat herders from which it is derived.

|
11:30 am, Jun 1, 2009

This comment has been removed by The Daily Beast's editors.

|
|
Reply
|
7:41 pm, Jun 1, 2009
tankertodd

The motto "do no harm" apparently doesn't apply to viable babies who haven't had the privilege of exiting the surroundings of the mother's body I guess. Makes about as much sense as anything these days.

|
11:28 am, Jun 2, 2009
Scyldemort

In fact, more people SHOULD consider this line of work. We need more qualified doctors to be involved in women's health services, and your misguided equation of late term abortion with murder is asinine at best. Remember, folks: in most cases, a late term abortion happens specifically because carrying the baby to term will put the mother's life in danger.

|
12:12 pm, Jun 2, 2009
SharksBreath

Terrorism is Terrorism.

Rather your a Muslim Extremist or Christian Extremist.

It seems both of them think killing in the name of there God is OK.

How many deaths has religion been responsible for on this earth.

Now that the right has turned into the American Taliban it's a good thing we have that warrant less wiretapping and can detain terrorism suspects without trials.

Maybe Bush was a visionary.

"If you have nothing to hide you have nothing to worry about."
Michele Malkin.

|
|
Reply
|
7:21 am, Jun 1, 2009
dlc1550

"Now that the right has turned into the American Taliban it's a good thing we have that warrant less wiretapping and can detain terrorism suspects without trials.
"
Sharkbreath - you beat me to it.

Now you KNOW the far right is going to have a hissy fit over being called the Taliban.

|
|
Reply
7:52 am, Jun 1, 2009
mattlayo

the Taliban beat women in the streets, stoned them to death at halftime of soccer matches, killed tens of thousands of their own citizens, harbored the people who brought about the end of the lives of 3,000 of OUR citizens....And a bunch of people who just refuse to believe the same as you do are equal to the Taliban? Wow.grab a little piee of reality and call it your own. This statement is just the sort hyperbolic drivel Rush spews daily from the right.

|
|
Reply
2:22 pm, Jun 1, 2009
robjh1

Killing this doctor doesn't prove anything. Killing this doctor further strengthens the abortion rights activist.

|
|
Reply
7:39 am, Jun 1, 2009
sonofloud

Right wing revenge???
The right wing has been in charge for the last 8 years.....this is just Obama continuing their radical attempt to outlaw abortion by giving the catholics a 2/3's majority on the Supreme Court.

|
|
Reply
|
8:56 am, Jun 1, 2009
Twisted

You are incorrect these radical flat earth taliban conservatives have been in charge since 1994(maybe even since the early 1980's when saint Ronald Reagan brought in the james watts and anne burfords who packed federal agencies with ideologues), when the "newties" took over congress.. Although I agree with the basic conclusions of the author of this article she has neglected to even look at the components of the "...vast right wing conspiracy..." (as coined by Hillary). The pro life anti abortion people are only the tip of this dangerous iceberg. Add in the militia people, skin heads, neo nazis, KKKs, aryan brotherhood, etc; make no mistake about it these white christian groups all harbor armed terrorists who have contributed to acts of terrorism and murder of their political and ethnic opponents. I'm way more fearful of these home grown terrorists than i am of middle eastern terrorists because they live and work right next door to us all(they are Sarah Palin's small town real americans). Just look at the "rants and raves section on your local craigs list since thisw election cycle began it has been filled with arising tide of hate speech(racism anti semititism. anti hispanic, anti immigrant). Our government has done little to protect us from these individuals and has been totaly ineffective(could this be because so many local law enforcement peole are members?) in foiling their plots.The most effective trackers of these groups and their plots has been the Southern Poverty Law Center and the Bnai Brith ADL and the organizations they have set up.. The most effective actions against these groups has been civil law suits on behalf of victims and their families which have bankrupted these hate groups (Thank you Mo Dees). There is no need to even consider abrogating our constitution or constitutional rights to track and prosecute these people; just some purpose and effort by committed law enforcement. A few weeks ago i was dragged unwillingly to a local tea party event by some local lifestyle bikers ( who wanted to see the featured guest Ted Nugent not participate in politics) there was lots of hate talk, i spied numerous local police officers and some pa state police officers also (all participants) even my outlaw bikers were intimidated and we left (to my relief ) in less than 10 minutes. This anger is real and being fed by Rush, Newt(my town is his original home) Dick, Glenn Beck Fox news, Sean Hannity et ux;while the main stream media has remained cowed and silent to these disturbing influences..

|
|
Reply
|
10:50 am, Jun 1, 2009
scough

"Et ux" means "and wife". What about Sean Hannity's wife?

|
1:39 pm, Jun 1, 2009
Centrist

Although some of your ideas seem worthy of consideration you weaken your case by poor English usage. All proper names as well as the personal pronoun should be capitalized. Use some paragraphs to separate major ideas. I just can't give much creedence to someone who comes across as poorly educated or so hasty that they can't be bothered to organize their arguments.

|
11:54 am, Jun 2, 2009
Alterego

What amazes me is that those frenzied maniacs are oblivious to the millions of children who are actually living, breathing and suffering in orphanages all over the world. If you have extra-time on your hands, why not try and save the kids who live in poverty, on the streets, being used as child soldiers or slaves. I find "pro-life"rs to be so hypocritical and disgusting in their blind hatred they masquerade as love. Sure let's protect unborn foetuses and demonize mothers, doctors and science! Nothing is easier than idolize this idea of angelic unborn children and go and a crusade when you don't really have to do anything substantial. How about giving all the money that you have wasted to print out the gory pictures and assemble crowds to the teenaged mothers, or poor mothers who decided to keep their kid? How about doing something about rapists? About poor healthcare system that makes it impossible for some to afford having a child in the first place? All those religious nuts can do is find an "enemy" and hate with all their hearts and wallets...What kind of a pro-lifer are you when you kill a person, who has actually lived, worked, helped other people? You cannot possible equate him to a clot of cells, nerves and blood vessels that may or may not be born into a human being! If you follow this logic why not go further, why not eternally preserve all the sperm and eggs ever produced because they have the potential to create a foetus, ad thus you are destroying a phantom 'baby' every time a sperm dies??

And for the last time, I am sick of men trying to control what women should do! Back off of MY body, which is MY temple, and that you have NO authority over! In some sense rape and denying a woman her rights to have an abortion are very much alike... If a woman chooses to have an abortion it is solely HER choice and you have no say in it whatsoever...not even if your supposedly 'holy' book selectively compiled by women-hating religious nuts some centuries ago tells you otherwise...

|
|
Reply
|
9:02 am, Jun 1, 2009

This user is no longer registered.

|
|
Reply
|
10:25 am, Jun 1, 2009
Uberjeff

Firstly, what we do with the unwanted children who are born to unready mothers is a huge part of the issue. Condemning a child to a life of abject poverty, a horrible disease or deformity, the stigma over being a child of rape or ruining a young woman's life is it's own kind of cruelty. If we don't take care of the children we have no right to convince a woman that keeping that child is the best choice.

Second, calling abortion murder infers that you believe the fetus is fully formed, capable of self sustained life and has a soul. At what point does that soul exist? Is it in the egg? Is it in the sperm as the bible suggests? Many religions believe that life doesn't begin until the baby takes it's first breath, are they right? I think the answer to this question is more complicated than either side of the issue wants to admit. I think neither pro-life or pro-choice advocates want to accept that perhaps a fetus is less than human and more than nothing. That abortion isn't murder, but that it certainly isn't a benign act. This is a complicated issue and dismissing or demonizing people who think differently than you isn't going to solve the issue. All that does is incite murder and riot.

I truly believe that Dr. Tiller and his like believed they were helping women in unfortunate circumstances. That they provided safe and sanitary services where women would otherwise seek out more dangerous alternatives. I also believe that pro-life advocates truly believe that this is an inherently immoral act. However, unless they're willing to work and participate in finding better solutions then it's just empty rhetoric.

I respect people who protest outside of these clinics and offer counseling services to help young girls find adoption center instead of abortions. I respect people who donate to these clinics to help poor and underprivileged girls afford the treatments they seek. I deplore those who would seek the easy solution, harassing young women or maiming and murdering their doctors.

Finally, no one, man or woman, doctor or priest, government or church has the right to tell a young woman what to do with their body. No one has the right to force a woman to bare or raise a child conceived in rape. No one has the right to force a young girl to leave school for several months to carry a child whose father will never be able to support it, only to leave forgo any further education to raise their child alone. No one has the right to tell an expectant mother that they must carry to term a child with no skull who will die only month after birth. These are difficult situations that must be left to the woman, the advice of her doctor and her own personal beliefs in what is right and what is wrong.

|
11:49 am, Jun 1, 2009
comidoki

Wow.... As irrational and demented as the psychopath that shot Tiller?

The point is if rabid "pro-life" supporters put more effort into making abortion less necessary, it would have a bigger impact on reducing the number of abortions that are preformed in the US. I know what route Mother Theresa would take, and it wouldn't be to verbally and physically assaulting people outside of clinics or advocating for the murder of other people.

To the latter half of your comments.... I cannot believe you could actually type that post and start it out with commenting on someone else's confused logic. "Maybe we should just resort to absolute chaos where everyone can just do whatever without legal consequences?" You mean like walking into church and shooting someone because you don't believe in abortion?



|
12:26 pm, Jun 1, 2009
Alterego

"The point is that what these doctors are doing is murder". No, the point is that you THINK that it's murder, and the killing of Dr. George Tiller IS actually a murder...And of course I AM angry, as anyone able to think clearly would be - a man, a real living, breathing, thinking, acting human being was killed by a lunatic inspired by a randomly selected and often quite freely interpreted texts some people choose to worship instead of common sense...I wouldn't say that I'm demented or irrational though, since I wouldn't even think of killing anyone from a "pro-life" side, no matter how much they might amaze and shock me ... That would be immoral and inhuman, although may be not entirely Christian since religious nuts do think that somehow they have the license to kill...

As for the men telling women what to do with their bodies...of course I am aware that there are many women profilers but the whole movement (and especially aggressive organizations within it) is largely dominated and led by men; clergy is mostly men who brainwash women into feeling guilty about the choices they have absolute right to make. It may be OK with you, but it's definitely not OK with me that some authoritarian dude who I don't even know tries to control my choices and intimidate me into submitting to his questionable logic by way of spreading violence...

|
1:30 pm, Jun 1, 2009
trisha08

Why is that confused logic? If you are going to call yourself Pro-life, then you should be pro-life. It seems that once born, so called "pro-lifer's" could give a damn about life.

Torture...sure, why not.
War...we are O.K. with that
Death penalty....no problem
Child abuse, hunger, education.....huh? not us, we are busy protesting, and anyway--it sounds like socialism.

Seriously, you need to calm down and think about what you are saying. If you don't want an abortion, don't get one. But, quit trying to pretend that you are so concerned with life.

|
6:11 pm, Jun 1, 2009
trisha08

Thank you. So true. How about people like Palin (and others in this movement) who want to force woman to carry a child to term even in cases of rape or incest.

Talk about controlling women's bodies. A man rapes a woman and are going to force women to give birth to that child. Are they kidding? What year is this?

|
|
Reply
6:05 pm, Jun 1, 2009
muddog

How ironic, just as the wingnut base, Fox News and AM Radio fuel the flames someone is dead. This will not be the 1st incident.

Another Timothy McVeigh around the bend also?.

Mark my words, the creepy white, conservative, evangelical, the UN will come in with black helicopters, their taking our guns away wingnut's will start to pour out of the woodwork.

|
|
Reply
|
9:39 am, Jun 1, 2009
Dencal26

Who fanned the flames that lead to the murder of a US Military Recruiter today by African American Converts to Islam?? Code Pink ? San Francisco Liberals? Maybe YOU? Olbermann??

Military recruiter killed in Ark shooting
10 hours ago

LITTLE ROCK, Ark. (AP) - One Army recruiter was killed Monday and a second was wounded in a shooting at a recruiting office, and a suspect was arrested, police said

|
|
Reply
|
11:54 pm, Jun 1, 2009
LivingInCT

Ann Coulter, champion of gate speech. Wasn't it Coulter who said let's kill their leaders and convert them to Christianity? The man arrested for the murder is Muslim convert.

|
2:23 am, Jun 2, 2009
Johnny-Boy

I have been reading the boards about this, and I am apalled by the number of self described "christians" who are applauding this heinous act of cowardice.

Gunning down an unarmed 67 year old man in the lobby of his church, in front of many parishoners, there's nothing noble or "right" about it. Cowardice is cowardice, regardless of which book of scripture you subscribe to.

Alterego-
I agree with your statement regarding the MILLIONS of children, wanted and unwanted who suffer daily, all ovber this planet.

The extreme evangelical, far right wing stands against abortion, stands against anything other than "abstenance only" education programs, stand against a womans right of self determination, et cetera, et cetera. They always seem to stand against something, while standing for very little.

The person who committed this cold-blooded murder, and those terribly confused, twisted souls who applaud this stomach turning act of evil, have much to be ashamed of.

Acts of murder, while claiming to do "gods will", are acts of evil. And there is no difference between a muslim who murders in the name of Allah, and a christin who murders in the name of Christ, they are all cut from the same cloth.

A sad day for humanity.

|
|
Reply
9:39 am, Jun 1, 2009
smitisan

I want abortions to happen in back alleys where I don't know about it. All I want to hear is that another silly girl died by coathanger so I can feel justified. I don't want to know about gay people's problems, or anyone else's for that matter. I've got enough of my own, and I want to keep them between me and my priest so I can walk the streets in righteousness. Like Papa Bear says, SHUT UP SHUT UP SHUT UP! I want the world to be like it was when the sheriff didn't carry a gun and Opie didn't go around making trouble and Aunt Bea was our Virgin Queen.

|
|
Reply
9:49 am, Jun 1, 2009
connie47

The Supreme Court has stated, "When those trained in the respective disciplines of medicine, philosophy, and theology are unable to arrive at any consensus, the judiciary, at this point in the development of man's knowledge, is not in a position to speculate as to the answer."

Personally, I believe life begins at conception, but I also live under the law of the United States. I have no legal right to impose my beliefs on any other citizen and I have never made any attempt to do so. When the Christian right attempts to circumvent the law to suit its beliefs, it becomes indistinguishable from other religious fanatics, such as the Taliban.

|
|
Reply
|
9:55 am, Jun 1, 2009
pinkcrickets

Thank YOU for pointing this out. This was something that for all his faults, I thought John Kerry articulated really well: What he believes based on his religion, and what he should legislate other people to do, are two completely different things.

I am pro-choice and always have been, emphasis on the word CHOICE. Women should have a choice, made based on their own personal moral beliefs and the advice of their doctor. There is something really wrong about forcing a woman to bear a child *against her will* if she becomes pregnant - especially since there is no analagous attempt to hold fathers responsible (and the technology is there that we could).

I don't think I could ever have an abortion personally - but I really don't think it's up to me to decide if some teenage girl halfway through highschool should or should not have an abortion. And I think it is a complete fallacy of the pro-life movement that women take abortions lightly - it is something that effects a woman emotionally for the rest of her life

|
|
Reply
8:27 am, Jul 3, 2009
Kilgore-Trout

Well said Alterego. I am pro-choice and still donate to making living childrens lives better. I support a family of ophans in the middle east (the USA was responsible for many) through SOS Childrens Villages. Repukes only care for the fetus and tough sh*t after that. Welcome the American Taliban.

|
|
Reply
9:58 am, Jun 1, 2009
muddog

These same "Christians" are the bafoons who voted for Bush, no matter that his actitions has killed thousands....Maybe Arab babbies god does not care about?.

|
|
Reply
|
10:20 am, Jun 1, 2009
Dencal26

Arab Babies stopped dying on Jan 20th??

|
|
Reply
11:52 pm, Jun 1, 2009
MaliciousDisorder

WHAT GOES AROUND COMES AROUND

|
|
Reply
10:29 am, Jun 1, 2009

This user is no longer registered.

|
|
Reply
|
10:33 am, Jun 1, 2009
muddog

alcamadus.

I applaud your take on this event but I must digress. How many people have the left shot in cold blood in the US? Of even the most hardcore so called "lefty" how many push violence?

I find it odd that so many on the right refer to themselves as pro life and yet love war (Iraq) and defend it @ every change they get. They vote for candidates who consistently take from the poor and give to the rich ( many Dem's are Guilty of this outrage also but the G.O.P. are experts ) But by being anti abortion you are considered pro life...You cant have your cake and it eat too...Pro life means protecting ALL LIFE, not just a fetus or something as absurd as saving a stem cell....

Sorry but the far right has no room for compromise and he is the one that needs to be held accountable. If those of you on the Pro Life side want a civil debate then call out your hate filled compatriots......

|
|
Reply
|
10:57 am, Jun 1, 2009
Uberjeff

Back in the 60s and 70 the far left was fairly violent. The black panthers and other minority rights groups often had noble beginnings but fell to violence when they were unable to accomplish their goals peaceably. Anti war groups like the weather underground bombed government buildings and while they claimed they tried not to cause death and only to destroy property, people were inevitably killed.

However, you do have a point, the right has always been significantly more militant throughout the history of this country. This is likely due to the fact that most far right groups align themselves with the idea or religious or racial superiority, or a combination of the two. By broadly stating that any who disagree with them or differ with them in any way are inferior, sub human or in some cases servants of the devil, it makes violence that much easier to turn to. Sociologically the extreme far right groups in this country are no different than those like the Taliban, terrorists who impose their will on others out of a sense of religious or racial self superiority.

|
11:59 am, Jun 1, 2009
whipmawhopma

Uberjeff

I would assume that someone in the far right would be more likely to actually own a gun to begin with as opposed to someone on the far left, so this would cause a far right wing trend towards acts of violence to involve guns. The NRA has never struck me as having much of a lefty membership.

Your statement: "Sociologically the extreme far right groups in this country are no different than those like the Taliban, terrorists who impose their will on others out of a sense of religious or racial self superiority" seems to assign some exclusivity to extreme far right groups in this country.

Demonization of opponents exists in any extremist group regardless of their political, religious, racial and gender beliefs. Extreme leftists regularly demonize their opponents with a broad-brush, just as extreme rightist do the same. I think this is why Americans in general are moving towards centrist views. They are tired of the whackos. I'm tired of them.

This is not unique to the United States.

|
12:33 pm, Jun 1, 2009

This user is no longer registered.

|
1:31 pm, Jun 1, 2009
Dencal26

The term Pro Life is specific to the issue of the unborn. It has nothing to do with those on death row.

|
11:51 pm, Jun 1, 2009
LivingInCT

I always suspect the sincerity of someone who argues a point by beginning with with "murder is wrong" followed quickly by "HOWEVER..."

You bring up the morality of killing Hitler to save innocent lives, equating it to the murder of Dr. Tiller (offering it up as a way to understand extremists, saying it's not your view, but you do empathize). Framing it that way makes it immoral NOT to kill Dr. Tiller. What right-minded individual wouldn't kill Hitler? If you buy into that argument, then Dr. Tiller's murderer not only deserves to be acquitted, he deserves a medal, and the undying love and support of moral men and women the world over. It follows, then, that you are immoral by condemning the murder of a man morally equivalent to Adolph Hitler. As are anti-choice groups now decrying Dr. Tiller's murder.

You're either for something or you're against it. If you think Dr. Tiller was morally equivalent to Hitler, then why bother trying to sound like you're not delighted by his murder? I certainly never shed a tear when I learned Hitler put a gun to his head in 1945. Why are you trying to fight this kind of extremism if you empathize with the view that Dr. Tiller is Hitler in a sterile mask and gown?

Your argument lacks logic, coherency, consistency, and intellectual honesty. It discloses far more about the anti-choice position than you probably would like.

|
|
Reply
3:18 am, Jun 2, 2009
Centrist

In other (shorter) words. Why can't we just all get along? Good luck with that!

|
|
Reply
11:59 am, Jun 2, 2009
Sockit

There is no soul. Jesus was never born. Humans descend from rats. If there is a god-like "supreme being" - it is surely a killing MONSTER, a killer of cosmic proportions, and nothing to assure ORDER in this multiverse unknown, or on this doomed planet. What we do know is that the G-D of the Old Testament is a jealous, petulant, genocidal megalomaniac. And don't think that being his "chosen people" is such a good thing. Clue: you'll be driven from every country, hated by all, burnt at the stake, and gassed by the millions! In the blasphemous New Testament, he rapes a frail, ignorant virgin (Mary never gave consent) Zeus-like and then sacrifices by crucifixion his "one and only son," the schizophrenic spawn of his most unholy union ... some pater familias!

Is there any wonder this deity continues to drive his followers to murder?

|
|
Reply
10:33 am, Jun 1, 2009
ittybittykitty

I think what amazes me is that most pro-life folks are also for capital punishment. Isn't a life a life? Also, would Jesus condone blowing someone away in the name of a cause? Any cause? The hypocrisy is mind boggling. All my thoughts are with the doctor's family. This is so sad.

|
|
Reply
|
11:23 am, Jun 1, 2009

This user is no longer registered.

|
|
Reply
|
1:35 pm, Jun 1, 2009
AlanD2

Justice of law? What about the hundreds of murders and rapists who have been freed by DNA evidence? If these people had been convicted 50 years ago, they would have been executed without anybody (except the real perpetrators) knowing they were innocent.

Please note that these convictions usually had lots of circumstantial evidence and eyewitnesses. So how do you justify capital punishment, given the potential convictions of innocent people, especially in those cases where there is no DNA evidence?

|
6:33 pm, Jun 1, 2009
trisha08

Abortion is carried out under the law too.

Your reasoning is pretty weak. Let me get this straight, you are willing to save an "innocent" life but are willing to kill that same life later they turn out to be a criminal, right? If you are pro-life....A life is a life You are not pro-life, you are pro-fetus.

What about this? You save an "innocent fetus" and they are born into poverty, they are abused, neglected, have no education, no future, no hope and they turn to crime. Your actions placed them in this horrific situation, but now you think it's O.K. to kill them. You set them up for this, where is your responsibility in the situation.

|
6:38 pm, Jun 1, 2009
trisha08

You are saying that you the voice of the "innocents". How do you know what their voice is? Did you ever think that maybe they wouldn't want to be born? If I knew that I would be unwanted, abused, hungry, neglected,etc, I probably would say, thanks but no thanks.

|
6:45 pm, Jun 1, 2009
ittybittykitty

Huh?

|
2:02 am, Jun 2, 2009
ReasonMagazine

Far right, far left, it's all extremism and radicalism. No room for compromise or negotiation. Lots of room for anger and violence toward your brothers.

|
|
Reply
|
11:27 am, Jun 1, 2009
muddog

Far left?. Show me where the far left pushes violence like the far right. There are extreem's in all camps BUT the conServatives have a fetish for viloence.

|
|
Reply
|
11:52 am, Jun 1, 2009
Dencal26

muddog Weather Underground. FALN. Unibomber. Black Panthers. You need a list or a search engine?

|
11:50 pm, Jun 1, 2009
muddog

decal126.

Weather Underground? R U joking? How many have been killed by them?. Unibomber?. He was hardly a Liberal. Black Panthers, please....

|
1:06 pm, Jun 2, 2009
liviapeacock

Aborting a fetus, sad and awful as is it, and it is awful, is not KILLING a child!!!! These crazies have hijacked the definition of the procedure and morons all over the country think CHILDREN are being killed by evil doctors.

Please DB readers, correct the crazies!

|
|
Reply
|
11:39 am, Jun 1, 2009

This user is no longer registered.

|
|
Reply
|
1:38 pm, Jun 1, 2009
hardrain

How is a fetus not a child?
Because it is a fetus not a child.

|
5:39 pm, Jun 1, 2009
trisha08

Is a soldier human? Why no protesting of the war? Pro-lifers don't really care about life outside the womb.

Does not align with the majority of America or biological study? Really? Document that, please.

|
6:28 pm, Jun 1, 2009
AlanD2

This is not a personal opinion. This is the law of the land. You may not like it, but you must follow it or face the consequences.

|
6:36 pm, Jun 1, 2009
Uberjeff

I am not a practicing christian but was raised as one and have founded much of my morality on the man's teachings. I must say, from this perspective, the actions and demeanor of the far-right religious extremists in this country are very un-christian.

Persecution, judgment, calls for violence and murder. This is not what he taught, this is a sickness that twists his words into something altogether grotesque and unrecognizable.

|
|
Reply
12:07 pm, Jun 1, 2009
StevenWells

Pro-life, huh? That term really needs to be retired. Individuals who commit such acts - and those who support them, even by tacit approval - are clearly anything but.

|
|
Reply
12:10 pm, Jun 1, 2009
dragonfly3000

This is one of those issues, like death penalty and evolution, that are forever unresolvable because they are in most arguments (most, not all arguments) based in FAITH, which by definition, cannot be dis/proven.

This results, in a multicultural nation/world filled with different faiths, a necessity for a shared 'religious pragmatism'. If we both disagree, to use an example referenced already, on when the soul enters the body (conception v birth) then we may philosophically agree on the same issue (killing a child is wrong) for the same religious reason (child has a soul) but disagree on the moment that the context exists (birth or conception). So, you can have two people who fundamentally believe the same thing but who would have significantly different views on abortion.

The religious pragmatist would likely say: Look, we will never know for a FACT whether or not we have souls, when we get them, if/when we might lose them, we only have our differing FAITH in what/when/if it might be. Because we cannot define an absolute truth here, we have to allow for some level of divergent faith-based practices in so far as they might be consistent with other social compromises. (yes i know, many refuse on both sides to compromise on such an emotional topic, but bear with me.)

The "breathing on its own" standard is an example of such a compromise - the child is outside of the mother, so is fully a separate entity like everyone else is society, needy though it may be.

But if you believe that the soul is in place at birth, then for yourself, you would not abort. If you believe the soul comes later or not at all, then the breathing on its own standard would apply to your event. This is choice, yes, but allows for choice BASED ON YOUR OWN FATIH for your own event rather than someone else's faith imposed on your own event.

We can't resolve whether or not this is murder and we never will be able to. Best in these cases then to worry about your own soul and the souls of your own (potential) children as defined in your own religion than worry about others within their religion.

Much of these arguments is based in a monotheologic determinism - my way or the highway - cultural standard which is commonly employed by the religious right, and conversely, by die-hard atheists. Failing to recognize the reality of diverse faith-based opinions makes these arguments only theoretical and impractical.

Speaking with religious pragmatism, this is not nor will ever be a fully Christian nation in which every Christian believes the exact same Christian teachings and interpretations nor will it ever be a nation comprised fully of atheists.

Like Jack said, "Either we live together, or we die alone."

|
|
Reply
12:43 pm, Jun 1, 2009
Hawnzz

Why is it that only the radical and extreme right wing produce these people?

I am a Christian and I don't even know what to say.

As far as I know, the procedures he did were medical procedures to protect the lives of very sick women that most likely would not have been able to bring the pregnancies to full term anyway. It was not a form of birthcontrol.

If you were a husband left with a truly horrible choice, your wife or your unborn child.. what would you do? (There would be a large chance the child would not survive anyway.) For me it comes down to this... I love my child, but I've loved my wife longer. (And of course I'd only be half the vote.)

|
|
Reply
12:51 pm, Jun 1, 2009

This user is no longer registered.

|
|
Reply
|
1:40 pm, Jun 1, 2009
trisha08

They didn't kill anyone.

|
|
Reply
6:25 pm, Jun 1, 2009
drmarkklein

What a blessing to have done my medical training before Rowe so that I do not have the blood of innocents on my hands!

|
|
Reply
|
2:40 pm, Jun 1, 2009
chekov

Oh for Christs sake. Nobody forces doctors to do abortions, so stop with the sanctimonious crap.
If a person does not agree with abortion, then don't have one; or perform one.

I know a few docs who are abortion providers. They do them because they have compassion for their patients. And they continue to provide them in the wake of decades of murders, attempted murders, harassment, and defamation of their character. They are courageous and brave.
They do not hide behind ignorance like many of their anti choice colleagues.

|
|
Reply
|
3:48 pm, Jun 1, 2009
chekov

And doctor, you probably do have "the blood of innocents" on your hands if you trained before Rowe v Wade.
The blood of all the innocent women who had back street abortions who filled up emergency rooms with sepsis and other horrendous complications. Medical interns and Ob/Gyn residents, irrespective of their own personal views had to look after these women, who often died, leaving their children motherless.
Or did you train in some Utopia where women did not experience unintended pregnancies?

|
4:00 pm, Jun 1, 2009
socialworklady

Oh, Most Self Righteous Dr. Mark Klein,

May all the women who live in your area use their deepest intuitions and stay the hell away from you. Amen.

|
|
Reply
10:19 pm, Jun 1, 2009
pricklypear




"The rights of one human being can never be honored by diminishing or ignoring the rights of another. " - M. Dannenfelser, President of the Susan B. Anthony List

1-June-2009 -- Catholic News Agency,
Pro-life Leaders Decry Murder of Late-term Abortion Doctor:
http://www.ewtn.com/vnews/getstory.asp?number=95778
Pro-life Leaders Decry Murder of Late-term Abortion Doctor:

|
|
Reply
3:36 pm, Jun 1, 2009
Seaweed

I wish this right-wing terrorist filth would realize that the world will be much better when they're gone. Then go kill themselves. Like that pig in Pittsburgh who shot the 3 cops cuz he was 'fraid Obama was gonna take his guns away. Ignorant reptilian brains. Or this pig, and those that defend him. Bible says nothing about fetuses or abortion. You all talked yourselves into this.

|
|
Reply
5:58 pm, Jun 1, 2009
Leave a Comment
Leave a comment

Thank you.
As a first time user, your comment has been submitted for review. It can take anywhere from a few hours to a day or two for your comment to be reviewed, depending on the time of week and the volume of comments we receive.

View Comments
Leave a comment

Please log in to leave comments.

The Pro-Life Insurrection

by Michelle Goldberg

Info
RSS
Michelle Goldberg
Emails
|
print
Multiple Pages
|
text
-
+
Facebook
 | 
Twitter
 | 
Digg
 |