Blogs and Stories
The GOP Freak Show
Philadelphia Inquirer, MCT / Landov
Conservative radio talk-show host John Batchelor says the whack jobs disrupting health-care town halls confirm the Republican Party has become a cruise ship to the seventh grade.
The sad-eyed Townhall Turfers now follow the saucer-eyed Birthers and the cranky Tea-Baggers as the latest political fad that the weakling Republicans not only cannot get away from but also cannot get enough of, like chocolate sauce on anything. The phenomenon of surly, verbose, sweaty voters crowding into overlit public rooms to hear out the numbing conclusions of a member of Congress on health-care reforms in all the 57 varieties has taken over talk radio and talk TV and swept through blogs like swine flu’s mutation. The suspicion of many gifted sleuths, working in favor of the Obama administration, that these are not grass roots citizens but rather hirelings and toadies, the astro-turf-eaters of Homo Pachydermata, stampeding to the whip hand of secret Blofelds of the GOP, has suddenly become a White House approved narrative endorsed by the colorful Robert Gibbs, who judged, “The Astro Turf nature of grassroots lobbying” are “manufactured anger.”
The Turfers are freakish, passionate, half-baked, dignified, defiant, rude, anarchistic, but they are not Republicans.
Would this were the whole story. Would that the Republicans were capable of such a vast right-wing conspiracy to rally and deploy growling scene-stealers with signage that is indifferent to paradox, “Stop Obama,” “Stop Socialism,” “Stop Fascism.” Those who have discovered these shadowy links of the nonsensically named “Conservatives for Patient Rights” to the infamous Swift Boaters’ latest awkward fantasy, “Tea Party Patriots Health Care Reform Committee,” serve less to enliven their suspicions than they do to prop up the spirits of the deracinated Republicans. Over the last week, the Democratic blogosphere has given more credit to a party that doesn’t much exist than it has enjoyed since Karl Rove left the field of battle with his Slytherin wand. Skipping its yoga class, the DNC has air-dropped a shrieking memo accusing the Republicans of Mordor of “inciting angry mobs of a small number of rabid right wing extremists funded by K Street lobbyists… interested in ‘breaking the president.’” Democrats are imagining a Republicanism that is ambulatory, omnipotent like the fabled days of the Brooks Brothers Brigade storming Dade County in the stolen election of 2000.
None of this feared Republican virility is any more real than the charge that the GOP manufactured the Turfers. That is the true misery of the matter. The Turfers are freakish, passionate, half-baked, dignified, defiant, rude, anarchistic, but they are not Republicans. They are not even much of a mob, and references to the classic American uprisings from Shays Rebellion to the Wide-Awake Brigades at the birth of Republicans over the Kansas-Nebraska Act are distorting and tendentious. Studying the videos from Texas, Wisconsin, New York, what you can see and hear is frustration, fear, voyeurism, a sugar-high yearning for local TV sound bites and YouTube burlesque. If this is all you ask for in a mob, what are circus clowns for?
And what does the Republican Party provide the generally despairing and alienated American citizens who come out to the town halls? It answers shouts for help with teasing and cooing, the behavior of groupies with the language of quitters. Republican House Minority Leader John Boehner wrapped his teenaged threat of rowdyism over health care inside a flimsy, clichéd metaphor of summer, “I think it’s safe to say that, over the August recess, as more Americans learn more about their plan, they’re likely to have a very, very hot summer.”
Republican Party chief Michael Steele used the passive aggressive rhetoric of denial to aggrandize the reports of brouhahas at town halls, “We’re not encouraging people to be angry to the point of being mean, or nasty, or brutish. There is legitimacy to the protest. How people protest—I have no control over that.” Following up on his cheapskate mischief-making, Steele air-drops an RNC fund-raising screed that accuses the DNC of lies and by the way, concludes Steele admiringly, the Turfers are only using the DNC’s “standard playbooks of name calling and outright lies to stifle debate.”
John Talks Joe
Lloyd Grove is editor at large for The Daily Beast. He is also a frequent contributor to New York magazine and was a contributing editor for Condé Nast Portfolio. He wrote a gossip column for the New York Daily News from 2003 to 2006. Prior to that, he wrote the Reliable Source column for the Washington Post, where he spent 23 years covering politics, the media, and other subjects.
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Jacob Bernstein is a senior reporter at The Daily Beast. Previously, he was a features writer at WWD and W Magazine. He has also written for New York magazine, Paper, and The Huffington Post.
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Jeff Madrick is a contributor to the New York Review of Books and a former economics columnist for the New York Times. He is editor of Challenge Magazine, visiting professor of humanities at Cooper Union, and senior fellow at the New School's Schwartz Center for Economic Policy Analysis. He is the author of Taking America, The End of Affluence (Random House) and The Case for Big Government.
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John Batchelor is radio host of the John Batchelor Show in New York, Washington, D.C., San Francisco, and Los Angeles.
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John Batchelor is radio host of the John Batchelor Show in New York, Washington, D.C., San Francisco, and Los Angeles.
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John Batchelor is radio host of the John Batchelor Show in New York, Washington, D.C., San Francisco, and Los Angeles.
That was thoroughly enjoyable and right on the money. It is very sad, indeed, and poignant that you end your essay with such an eloquent quote from Edmund Burke, contrasting this philosopher, who is one of the roots of modern conservatism, with the circus of horrors that the Republican Party has become.
It's really too bad that people trying so hard to be heard are simply not being heard until they are really outraged.
B. S. These people aren't attempting to be "heard." They are there to keep anyone else from being heard.
B. S. indeed. Your right on Lyn.
Sad indeed that the people can't be heard.. they set up town hall meetings to explain the health care bill to a confused public, and they can't be heard over chants of "Don't let the government have control of my medicare" by people holding signs that say "Congress: Give us YOUR insurance plan" Taking up arms and starting fights in opposition of informing the people about the health care bill... looks like the mind control is working better and better..
Now the informed person sees those signs and hears what these people have to say and are saddened (or tickled), but you.. I guess I will have to explain it to: THE GOVERNMENT ALREADY RUNS MEDICARE, AND CONGRESS IS ON A SINGLE PAYER PLAN.
do any of you even realize how ridiculous this is?
It's true that when right wing protesters scream at the speakers
it's counterproductive and defeats the purpose for having
a civil dialogue.
Just as it is equally obnoxious when conservatives try speaking
at Universities and are drowned out by far left goons, when the
occasional pie or egg throwing contest breaks out.
Oh, give me a break. These disruptive nutjobs think that the Constitutional right to free speech means that only THEIR voices and THEIR opinions be heard. Any voice that differ from theirs is NOT allowed and shouted down. Seventh grade civility, indeed.
Count on the fact that people who are shouting the loudest about their Constitutional rights are making sure they infringe on everyone else's.
That, my friend, is called hypocrisy.
This comment has been removed by The Daily Beast's editors.
Yes I agree this goes both ways except that the right seems to have the corner on some real nut cases. One thing I have noticed is that I have not seen a case where there is one black, one Hispanic, or any other ethnic or race group in the protest. I am not throwing a racial bomb here but I find it interesting. I don't think these people are out and out racist but it points to a problem that is being uncovered here. Simply stated that there is a fear in the middle class white population that they are losing their rights because more and more the minorities are gaining the same rights that have been the norm for hundreds of years for white people. I am a middle class white person and it embarrasses me that we have not moved past this issue. Please republican leaders make it known that you are for balanced and civil dialog on all issues. You can be angry about an issue and yet discuss it with people of differing options.
These aren't some poor souls trying to be heard, they are tools of the GOP that are trying their best to keep others from being heard, democracyforall. Pull your head out of the sand. The only way the GOP is going to regain any credibility at all is if it's members like you hold them accountable.
I'm against violence or any group which disrupts the civility of any meeting. And I admonish anyone inciting these groups.
The humane thing to do is give these people an outlet instead of making media jokes out of them, cruelly labeling them turfers (from Nancy Pelosi's astroturf remark) or any other term, they are simply Americans who are upset. There are 2 sides to every story here. It takes 2 to tango.
Yes, but to suggest these are not republicans is disingenuous. I heard Jim DeMint say this week that Limbaugh isn't a republican, he's a conservative. One and the same. The republicans created this monster thanks to Karl Rove, Bill O'Reilly, Limbaugh, Beck, Dobbs, Malkin, Coulter and all the other media fascists. And they will have blood on their hands when someone inevitably gets hurt. Grow a set and stand up to it now. Tell them, in the name of the republican party to stop it before that happens. People have already been killed thanks to this extremist rhetoric. Maybe the last few responsible and intelligent republicans left should start a new party. It's disgusting!
And one of the most disgusting is that these yellers and screamers don't even know what they are yelling and screaming against. They don't know what is in the bill and they can't learn because none are so deaf as those who will not hear. Many of them are already receiving Medicare. I know I had a good insurance, I thought, until I was able to reach the age to have Medicare. My other insurance use to run me from Dr. Office to Dr. Office to get the same thing done that's being done now with the office right next door to my doctor. I got tired of having to get their approval to do something that very definitely needed to be done. If they could just sit and listen before they decide to protest they may like what they hear/or not..but at least they would have heard. I seems the ones doing the most yelling are the least educated of the bunch.
Let's be clear, they are not Republicans in the sense of RNC or elected Republicans. But, they are supporters of the Republican party for the most part, although many may be more anti-Democratic party than anything else.
This may be the real issue - the Republican party has lost control. They are being run by wild eyed freaks (including those on the radio and TV); the downside is that they are alienating the normal Republicans and Independents.
The public has not been given details on this health care reform. To support anything without the facts is stupid. Obama spent 6 months choosing a dog, yet we're supposed to support a bill without the facts in a few weeks? Change for the sake of change is bad. We need time to study the best approach and we need proof that it will work. And people need to have a choice when it comes to their own health.
Medicare is an existing, single-payer national health plan and it's going broke. Fix Medicare first, before forcing us to have a new national health plan.
Deeambro, you are exactly on the money. Have you also heard of Grover Norquist or Tom Delay? They are/ were worse than the names you mentioned above. Read the book "THe Wrecking Crew" by Thomas Frank and you will learn about the "conservative mind and philosophy". If it is not enough to keep you from ever voting along side these wing nuts, I do not know what would ever convince you otherwise.
John isn't going to get invited to many GOP fundraisers anymore. He and folks like Micky Edwards, Colin Powell, Kathleen Parker are now considered persona non grata in the Republican party. I do believe his main points. The GOP has no leadership. Those who claim to be leaders, Steele, Bohner, Palin, have no original ideas or solutions so they are left to be mere cheerleaders for those who really are running the GOP.
Actually, Joe Scarborough, former congressman and Republican cheerleader sees where the Republican Party is now and I swear I believe he is trying to move an agenda that says these guys are not the REAL REPUBLICAN PARTY... I think he has heard himself selling their agenda and realizes he will have to live with this BS if those Repugs on the hill are successful. He has a new book out and I really think he may understand that Sanford, Enright, Craig probably imploded from living the Republican lie...it is awfully hard to stay a neanderthal if you have access to a brain. Don't get me wrong, I think Scarborough is wrongheaded just less so than those cheney Republicans on the hill.
philmc -- "mind-control"? how optimistic of you. Amygdala-control is more like it. You mix the toxic self-hallucingen cocktails of uberPatriotism, uberReligiosity, and uberLimbaughism, and you have got an amygdala, the rage center, on self-generated steroids.
Minds? not so much. Dr. Amen does scans of wrecked minds like these and they are fraught with lacunae, gaping lake-like dead areas.
Demented in its etymology means 'deprived of mind' -- de-mented.
How about having a reporter there interviewing these 'outraged' attendants and find out what kind of health care coverage they have? I assume people who are covered and are paying their dues don't want to pay for anyone else. But more probably, these are people who haven't got a clue about what this legislation entails...and don't want to hear about it. If that is true...I was brought up to 'not speak up about things you do not know about'. Listen first...then voice your support or opposition in a coherant manner!
Oh please. Part of the outrage comes from the fact that our representatives in Congress have not read the legislation and probably never will, while at the same time urging us to support it. If our congresspeople won't read their own immensely complicated bills, why should we support them?
In Massachusetts we are being inundated by television promos stating that the Obama Healthplan will deliver healthcare in America a lethal blow and will evenually kill all mankind. And their CAP & TRADE rant. Yeah that crazed. These promos are offered up by something call Better Government Association (BGA) and the offer free membership. I SUSPECT THIS MAYBE THE WAY TO RECRUIT THOSE PEOPLE WHO END UP DISRUPTING THE HEALTHCARE TOWN HALL MEETINGS. These are the phone numbers they ask you to call to join
healthcare 1-800-774-3107
cap&trade 1-800-743-4913
I went to Pete Sessions' (R-TX, 32nd) Town Hall in Richardson, TX last Wednesday and it was quite the spectacle. Fortunately for Pete, he has a very large Republican base within his own district; so the Town Hall amounted more to a Pep Rally than anything else. Lots of seniors, which the Gallup polls show are the group most apposed to and cynical of Health Care reform. And lots suburban-looking, thirty-to-forty-something men holding signs warning of Marxism, etc.
The Town Hall started at 7 PM, and while the room was packed to overflowing by that time (about 300 people) - and spilling out into the hallway, down the civic center and out the building - people continually trickled in all night. I didn't notice any one or two groups of people together. Rather, it was a more a large collection of people united in their various shades of opposition to the last six months. If they took their Q from anyone, they did it individually, I'd say. I didn't see anyone openly identifying themselves from the Democrat side. I didn't feel it was a very 'fair and balanced' affair, but hey, I'm in a Republican district, what can you do?
Anyway. I appreciate the organization and airing of grievances, but the stuff I'm seeing and reading about is out of hand. I think anyone from the Right that can take 10 steps back and look at the situation objectively should realize that Republicans aren't fomenting this - but they aren't calling for moderation either. Those in positions of power realize Obama and the Dems MUST be defeated on this measure. If he were to win this and it actually works (and being an insurance professional and having read a wide variety of objective commentary about it - I have no reason to think it won't) then the script will be flipped on Sen. DeMint: it will break the GOP.
My 79 yro Mother said it was a bunch of ignoramuses who are too stupid to realize that they are on government healthcare with Medicare and the younger people were not any better. She said ignorance was rampant. She went because she wanted to talk to Sessions and ask him why he is a racist, but did not get the opportunity. BTW, we're white.
right on! give your good mom a big hug from all of us SANE people out here.
It was chilly being around so many rabid Republicans, but I did go for the spectacle more than anything. That's too bad your mother didn't get to speak because the only people Rep. Sessions invited to speak at the front were 1st) Women age 60 and over followed by 2nd) Men aged 60 and over. How curious that most opponents to the overhaul are senior citizens then, no? One lady correctly pointed out that in the recent past Uncle Pete has voted for a $1.3 trillion tax cut, two wars totalling $3 trillion and the very controversial $1.2 trillion gift to the drug companies, the 2003 Medicare overhaul. His response was that the Bush Tax cuts created 5 million jobs (which isn't true), I won't comment on the wars because they speak for themselves, and he highlighted how great it is that you can get $4.00 generics at WalMart. I would've loved to have heard her ask her question. There was scant dissent against him. No one asked him about his $1.6 million military blimp either.
Dear planetgroucho,
Thank you! Extremely good and thoughtful response. The comment sections get far too few of them!
Very well stated and very interesting as well. Thank you.
A very enlightened post. It appears the Republicans, at least nationally, are try to make up for their lack of approval by upping the volume, and hoping no one notices the difference. The sense of desperation you point out with such clarity is palpable and ugly.
The hypocrisy of those elders, obviously on welfare and social security, who are SHOCKED, shocked, at the idea of government run, socialized healthcare in America, is unbelievable.
So just to save the good ol GOP millions must continue to suffer. Why are the people who have so little, the ones who want to share the most? If greed is the motivation of the GOP well it wont be the first party sent in retirement in this country..
You are right, the (R) party is not fomenting this... the insurance industry and big pharma lobbyists are behind these disruptions. Those in the (R) party are along for the ride cuz they aren't smart enough to have created Tea parties or disrupting town halls themselves.
Of COURSE your republican town hall was civil planetgroucho, it was full of (R)'s. Why would the lobbyists go bust up an (R) affair?
I am of the firm belief, having read a wide variety of objective facts AND commentary on the subject; single payer is the only answer. All this 1000 pages of BS going thru congress is a waste of time.
Single Pay or NO WAY! Veto the health care bill unless it contains only a single payer option.
And for those of you who continue to vote against your own interests, why don't you really REALLY stand up against socialized medicine and take up this mantra:
"No government run health care; End Medicare NOW!"
You can replace the word "Medicare" with "Veterans Care" (yeah, during this time of war, lets SCREW our vets!!!) or "Federal Employee" (over a million federal employees and our politicians enjoy this "socialist nightmare") , depending on who your audience is.
Why do you think so many people choose to scam seniors...they are the most vulnerable to suggestion...many are lonely, living on a fixed income and entering early dementia...and if you add that to people who are not too happy that the current President has a permanent suntan...well there ya go!
The Republcan Party is far worse than a cruise ship to the 7th grade, they're more like the Titanic heading for an iceberg.
And no matter how much they are told there is an iceberg ahead, they refuse to change course.
Our current healthcare system is a case in point. It is financially unsustainable and doesn't work in the best interests of the vast majority. People who lose their jobs, lose their healthcare. People who lose their healthcare insurance and incur a serious illness often go bankrupt. There are estimates of 1 million per year suffering this kind of ruin.
And yet, the Republican Party is determined to support the excessively profitable private healthcare insurance industry to the detriment of America's citizens, businesses and the government itself.
Iceberg straight ahead!
As a seventh grade teacher, I must speak out on behalf of my students. None of them has ever behaved as badly as the Republicans who have disrupted these meetings. My kids know better.
Hear, hear!
On the flip side, it is nice to see a conservative speaker recognize that communism and fascism are mutually exclusive.
Brilliant
Its the old "Beer Hall Putsch" strategy.
Been done before and no doubt will be done again.
These days the politicians should be running scared, their lies, deceit and policy of the politicians, for the politicians, by politicians is coming to an end. I hate to burst their bubble but the sleeping middle class is waking up to their games.
They have lost their minds and all of their ethics; they only do what they want for whatever reason they want. The Voters are in their opinion are just getting in the way until it's time to get reelected then its look what I've done for you.
Well the middle class is waking up and speaking out, and the politicians don't like it. The rumble started a long time ago and slowly has increased over time and here and now they are saying enough is enough.
To the politicians they are saying you claim fiscal responsibility then spend a trillion dollars in credit card economics, you waste billions on pet projects, you condemn the car companies for coming to DC with their tin cup in hand to beg for money, but fly on private jets, yet you order a new fleet of private jets for yourselves. You rush through legislation that no one reads and you ask us the people to trust you.
Well the time of reaping is at hand, and to all of the politicians out there you reap what you sow, and your legacy of lies, deceit, and going against the will of the people, whom you took an oath to serve is coming back to haunt you and its riding a pale horse.
To all the readers out there I say get off the couch and into the game, get informed, and don't just listen to the BS and rhetoric that some people are spouting. Ask question, and hold these public servants to their word and if they lie, misinform you or do anything that you don't like VOTE against them.
Remember that in this country the power is in the hands of the people, and we elect individuals to govern over us. For too long these elected officials have misused and abused that trust and power that we have given them. Now is the time to hold them accountable because this is a country that is of the People, by the People, for the People. And if the politicians have forgotten that then it's time for them to find a new job.
Allguns, I have been saying the same thing for some time now and your accessment of the actions of our elected officials is right on. I have lost all faith that those we elect are actually working for us, and instead have only their interests in mind. If there is one thing that I can agree with the repugs on, it's the total lack of fiscal restraint on the part of those we elect to work for us. These "projects" and the millions of dollars they spend on them is ludicrous, it is no wonder that this country can't afford to see to the health and education of it's citizens. I have written to the President numerous times complaining about this group of bluedogs who are supposely writing reform on healthcare, the same group of politicans who take millions from the very group that they are trying to reform! Are all Americans brain dead? Why do we sit and allow these politicans to lie to us, spend our treasury like there's no end to it and then reward themselves with 3 brand new jets so they can be comfortable when flying? Your best line: "For too long these elected officials have misused and abused that trust and power that we have given them". It's time the people stood up and said "enough".
FY
I used to work for a state elected official and I know for a fact not all politicians are ripoffs. But I tire of voters whining about the idiots they elect to office. These guys don't get there on their own. You have to UN-ELECT these crooks and that takes work and effort. Thus far most Americans would rather bitch and moan about thse people rather than taking them down. All you have to do is UN-ELECT a couple of them to send the message. But we get so angry and frustrated, we walk away and leave our government to another generation of creeps.
But hey the media plays a role...they can tell us that Sanford is a cheat, but they don't have the cajones or ethical gumption to call Republicans on their BS or call racism what it is or scamming with the health lobby an abomination and the media wonders why we hate their ambiguous guts! They equivocate their souls away for fear of losing ads or whatever. We have to own the neanderthals in our government and in our media and then throw the bums out!
Glad you got that off your chest, are you?
Dusty and Allguns,
Great posts. The problem is trying to get thru to these guys when most have their eye on the millions in campaign donations from Big Healthcare and Pharma there for the taking. Somehow the voice of the people has to overcome this, but it is difficult.
Donations from Big Healthcare and Big Pharma should be banned.
And lobbyists too.
campaign finance reform..
Nah, just stop electing weak minded, addle-brained two bit crooks to office./
Allguns & DustyMills: Voters are a dime a dozen. You guys forget that politicians have to produce results for their campaign contributors. Campaigns are not cheap these days, and without large contributors, politicians cannot get elected.
If you really want change, I'd suggest pushing for publicly-funded elections. Pass a Constitutional amendment outlawing private campaign contributions. Until this happens, politicians will continue to be owned by large corporations.
Amen, brother. The Supreme Court gave corporations the same rights as individuals back in the early '60s and the nation's been going downhill ever since. Personal power was undermined in favor of big groups with selfish ends. It was probably the worst decision of the so-called "liberal"
Warren court.
This user is no longer registered.
Hear hear! AlanD2. Well said
Remember that in the country, the people in November freely elected a President, 33 senators and a full House. As with all elections, some voters didn't see their choice elected. The Repugs were soundly rejected. Get over it. The wingnuts are only making yourselves look like bigger losers.
And it 's always the ones with the least (money and education) who are out there screaming against their own self interest. How low can you go. Many of them hate President Obama so much until they would cut off their nose to spite their faces. Stupid.
>sigh<
"Remember that in this country the power is in the hands of the people, and we elect individuals to govern over us."
Yes. His name is Barack Obama, and he won in a landslilde, on a platform of healthcare reform. You mistake being load and mad for being a majority.
Yes politicians should be accountable, and frequently aren't. But next tine you're shouting "YOU WORK FOR US!" remember that they also work for the majority that wants this legislation. Get off the couch and get into the game indeed; but the only rhetoric and BS I hear right now is coming from the Palin/Limbaugh base.
And I'm sorry, but few things creep me out more than someone named "Allguns" throwing out threatening metaphors from Revelation.
Yes, rusty, very creepy indeed...
Lets see who really is more closer to Hitler and his Third riech.Who's father and grandfather had ties to Hitler and made a fortune on Wall st from Hitler it was Bush41 and Bush43.Who's presidency was a dictator like hitler Bush43.Who called on a New World Order in front of congress in 1991 as hitler wanted a one world domination Bush41.Who belongs to a secret society cult called the Skull and Bones and promotes Thrid riech tatics of a New Global Order Bush41 and Bush43 and let me get one thing straight I am not a liberal or conservative .But a believer in Christ jesus who see's something truely wrong with whats going on.This false claim of these phony christians claiming to be something your not.When your involved in a cult and saying your a christian and using trickery to make others believe your a christian.Your a false teacher the one paul takes about in 1timothy.fakes,frauds and powermongers as john Hagee calls them.So who really is closer to Hitler I would say the Bush's and the Neo-Con's fourth riech.Evangelics I am praying your father in heaven will remove the scales from your eye's to see whats happening to you,you are being misled by tyrants.And ungodly people who jesus takes about and says many will come in my name but they are wolfs in sheeps clothing.Well they are leading you to the gates of hell.Open your eye's go into scripture be like the bereans.Those leading the republican party are'nt who you think they are Look at all the sexual immorality is that christian.Why would you not want to help the poor and the needy as jesus did.They have you brainwashed.VERY SAD I'll pray for you...! God have mercy on them.
nice points. don't forget that Hitler's army was the first "christian Army" with god telling dolf darling that he should take over the world by establishing racial superiority. that is why they had crosses on all their planes and tanks.
Uh ...Hitler despised Christianity and was more inclined to place his faith in the esoteric.
Do your homework on Adolf.
cathay: Many of our politicians and religious leaders despise Christianity too, but you would never know it from what they say in public. These cynical SOBs know how to manipulate people and the media. As did Hitler.
Actually German Wehrmacht had "God is with us" on their belt buckles in WWII
I think the Crusades were the first real Christian army. Although there are many descriptions of war in the Bible though not so many in the New Testament.
Hitler believe in Wagner's anti Semitic views, and his own of Teutonic superiority and twisted fables of their (Teutonic) past.
Vintage footage of his earlier parades show the paraders dressed in Teutonic drag, and that surely stimulated Hitler's testerone zone, if all the drugs he was on did not numb his brain receptors to produce any.
Cathay: True, Hilter may have despised Christianity, but he USED it to sway the masses. Looks like your homework is incomplete.
Poor John Batchelor longs for the return of the party that at one time I respected even if I didn't belong to it. It has degenerated into a circus of phony baloney with one thing and one thing only in mind - preserving the gravy train for the robber barons who have been pulling the strings in the GOP for the last 30 years. Today's republican party is a disgusting web of lies and deceit that has persuaded millions to vote against their own self interest by capitalizing on the made up non-sense of the distorted "culture wars". I hope the 2010 election pounds a stake into its heart. Once the GOP is done then maybe we can start working on straightening out the democratic party.
Once they started saying that we were planning to kill small children and old people, I simply stopped listening to them. I no longer believe anything they say.
Once people start saying that you're going to commit genocide, then there's nothing more to talk about. Those are fighting words where I come from.
Yeah, but you dismissed them before they said this, so I don't fret about your so called disappointment. But hey since I'm in an Alinsky mood right now, you ....uhhhh wanna fight? OK, You Democrat guys love it when women have an abortion. One less kid to exhale CO2 and add to global warming. Come on McMchugh, you secretly want all the old people to go away to, they are such a drag on our healthcare system. What with all the hip replacements and glaucoma treatments...they cost us too much. Let e'm wither away. Come on, come on, you do want that, don't you?
Picachu, you're funny.
( "Today's republican party is a disgusting web of lies and deceit" )
Well, it's a damn good thing the Democrats have integrity. Hilarious.
Thank goodness Mr. Batchelor isn't condescending.
How dare the " mob " demand that politicians
actually read the Bills they sign.
Why can't this country have more civilized protesters
such as Liberal ACORN. L.O.L.
Don't try to thrust your desires on us. That's what you want because me and most of the liberals that I know never talk about things like that. And we certainly never talk about women having abortions, because we feel that is the woman's business, not ours. You republs can't even save yourselves because you are too busy trying to live other folks lives. Do all that you can with your own life to make a better world and you won't have time to nose in what others are doing. In the end, if I believe like you, the only life you are going to be questioned about is your own; not someone else's.
Amen.
sophia5: If ACORN had protesters, I'm sure that they would be much more civilized that the conservative "brown shirts" provided by corporate-run conservative organizations such as Freedom Works, Conservatives for Patients Rights, and Patients First, Patients United Now.
These groups, egged on by Rush Limbaugh and Fox News, seem to be fomenting a new violent American revolution. You correctly characterize these people as a "mob". You can laugh, but I fear that this could lead to violence. Dr. Tiller's assassination is a good example of what can happen.
Even with the newsman on MSNBC calling out each senator and telling you how much money they were getting from these big insurance compnies. But then he was only singing to the choir; because the ones who need to listen are listening to Rush and all the other overpaid folk who could give less than 2 cents about them only as far as it helps their ratings and increases their pockets. Once they have voted themselves out of the option then Rush and the rest will just laugh at them and move on to the next self interest agenda that they want the ignorant to support against themselves and for them.
I think its actually an encouraging sign of life from this country. I always fear that some day people will become so complacent and trustful in their elected bureaucrats that they will be deceived more so than they have been already.
SHOUT LOUDER. Show them you are still alive and powerful. I'm Loving it.
I cannot think of one great step forward that was achieved by shouting louder, or selfishly canceling out other's right to have a voice.
Then you don't know the history of how this country was formed or how the slaves were freed or how women got the vote here. None of that was done by calm and rationality. Your ignorance amazes me, but that's how we got to this point, isn't it?
Scrapette---
Perhaps we are having a semantics problem here. What I meant is that history does not step forward on the decibel level of shouting. It steps forward with marches, protests, the well written words of great and men and women willing speak up. But the shouting interrupters at these town hall meetings are doing nothing to add to the discourse. They are in fact trying to shout the conversation down and out. I do not find them heroic, I find them selfish.
Check out Scrapette: she thinks obstructing healthcare reform is as noble as emancipation and women's suffrage.
Really? You think acting like thugs and preventing people from having a rational discussion is good for our country? Why do you hate America?
ChristianJ, I agree. I would also add that when an administration promises transparency but doesn't give it, promises fiscal responsiblity but pushes bailouts and giveaways that quadruple what they criticize their predeseccor for, promises bill signing waiting periods so that we can read it but fails to do that, and promises integrity but sets up a snitch office...then pissed-off patriots shouldn't really be a surprise at all to them or to any of you. You can call them anything you want to but it only fuels their anger. It's called Democracy and it's messy and dirty, but it works best that way.
StellaRay: You should watch "One Woman One Vote" from the American Experience series; you would learn that the women who fought for suffrage for seventy-two years were savvy, smart, brave, dignified, politically astute, and filled with perseverance.
In fact, they maintained a calm, rational demeanor even when men pelted them with rotten tomatoes and their fellow women, who were anti-suffrage, used vicious propaganda against them. (By the way, their enemies were conservatives of both parties.) But in the end they triumphed in 1920 because they remained calm and rational and dignified. Check out the documentary; it is very inspiring.
Dylan,
Thanks for the suggestion. I have saved it on my desktop and will check out "One Woman One vote when I have the time.
I'm thinking it will probably speak to the choir where I am concerned. I majored in history, took as many women's history courses as I could. My minor was in political science. I don't say this to brag in any way, because my college education is due to the generosity of my parents and the luck of the draw to land somewhere it was possible.
Dylan, you will not find anyone who is more a believer than I in the bravery of those that stand up for the truth with calm, dignity and rationality.
ChristianJ: This is exactly the way that Hitler rose to power, with his Brown Shirts rioting and overpowering the democratically-elected government of Germany in 1933, with the support of many large corporations (who later regretted it when they lost control of him).
Could this happen here? I doubt it. The Brown Shirts were young men, while today's protesters are more of a senior generation. And who today could play the roll of Hitler? Rush Limbaugh? Bill O'Reilly? Sarah Palin?
No, there will not be a revolution. But this does not preclude civil violence, up to and including assassinations - it certainly looks like some conservative extremists would love to target Obama.
So these protests / riots are "an encouraging sign of life" only if you hate democracy and civilized discourse.
Oh I get it AlanD2, if we disagree with Obama, we should sit down , shut up and know our place. Please stop comparing this to the Nazi's if anything, the SEIU, ACORN and for that matter Obama himself are acting like National Socialists( that is what Nazi stood for if you had paid attention in history class). Come up with something more original. The fascist/Nazi thing just doesn't work anymore. Not that you'd know what one is....but Rahm Emmanuel and Linda Douglass come close.
Hey got an idea, why don't you call Emmanuel or some other Alinsky sycophant and learn how to use the term correctly? Wow, calling taxpaying Americans the mob and Nazi's when you give worthless ACORN types who don't work a pass along with the SEIU types who barely work and contribute little to nothing to society but expect a whole lot.
I watched a guy in St. Louis get his ass kicked because he dared to be a black guy who disagreed with SEIU on the Healthcare issue. I hold all of them and any of you that apologize for them in contempt.
bcaldwell: The video shows a SEIU union member on the ground. The St. Louis Post-Dispatch has a story on this (http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/stories.nsf/laworder/story/0470FEB32 19207458625760B001142AC?OpenDocument) that does not mention who started the fight.
Given the way that most conservative Republican officials and commentators lie these days, I would not trust their web sites and news reports on this issue.
Hey AlanD@, you can check all the stuff out on this and obfuscate all you want, but nothing beats first hand witness...and that's me, I was there and no one paid me. The SEIU guys didn't like what he was passing out, one of them - a black guy says to him something to the effect, "what's a little N****R like you doin' here, you better get out of here before you get hurt" The guy said nothing and continued on that's when the SEIU guy decided that the dude was off the plantation and needed to be dealt with.
I stayed out of it- watched from across the street. People were arrested-6 of them including the 2 SEIU guys...oh and that guy from SEIU that was on the ground, he was there on the ground because he was trying to wrestle the guy down- the guy squirmed out. Unions = THUGS.
So now you have a first hand account of what happened .... But, I'm sure you are gonna say that these poor SEIU guys were only defending themselves. Actually, I welcome the SEIU into this debate, most of their members make the Teamsters look like PhD candidates. I figure they are good for a few more fights..but the Congressman are showing their yellow side and canceling these events . All except that Cohen guy in Memphis, I may not agree with him, but at least he has balls and gives as good as he gets.
John,
What's your point?
"the GOP sucks" because they are responding to a passionate part of their base?
"These are not republicans?" Well then as independents, their voices should be even more relevant, right?
"half baked...out of touch..." You paint with as wide of brush as the pols you criticize.
Great prose, but this article is of zero informational, value save to those that might wish to wallow in some sort of loathing of the GOP. It expresses lots of unsupported opinion but has too much hyperbole and allegory in its criticism of hyperbole and allegory.
Hochmeister,
As an independent, I resent the association of these people with the independent party. They can call themselves republicans all they want, but their actions are not conducive to the republican party's goals or values, except in the most distorted, convoluted ways. I suppose I lean farther left than right, but I see no problem with the republican party's stated mission of fiscal responsibility and the like. However, these people have effectively hijacked the republican party and dismiss any accusations of such actions as treachery.
This article was not intended to be informational, only to provide a new perspective for an increasingly ugly situation. Please reconsider what you hope to gain by slamming this article.
Lenywins,
I'm an Independent, too, and I agree with you. My husband is a former lifelong Republican, who switched to Independent during the last 8 years, and he agrees with you, too.
My wife and I are registered independents and agree with Lennywins. The actions of the extreme right wing of the repub party has us leaning very left.
Hey Lenny, should Republicans and conservatives just go back to being the tax collectors for the welfare state? Should we not express our outrage over more government intrusion? It's OK when the poor do it when they want the government to do for them, but you guys deride the middle and upper middle class who actually pay for the worthless SOB's at the bottom like ACORN and SEIU types.
Naaah they are not authentic, they just work for a living. They want to know what is in the bill and then you fault them for getting outraged when a schlub like Russ Carnahan can't answer the questions asked of him? Carnahan's lucky he was only insulted. Someone wants to take my money for a BS plan like this, they might get it, but they are going to the hospital first.
n September 12th there is an expected march on Washington by the teabaggers. They have set up this website to recruit their minions: http://912dc.org/
The Progressive and Democratic proponents of the healthcare reform should have organized THEMSELVES. The amount of press this event is going to receive is going to overshadow the Healthcare bill and Progressiv es/Democra ts/Liberal s have done little to have their voices heard. Please pass this on with the hope that this will inspire Pro-Reform advocates to fight back. It is time to forget pragmatism and promote action.
And wear heavy hiking boots, the Repugs like to step on non-Repugs feet, then say "oh i am so sorry" in the most priss pot way you will ever hear.
So you are looking to start trouble on 9/12? Let's rock, sister, I'm game. It might be fun to watch you progressives....NEO BOLSHEVIKS cry. I call on all REAL Americans to organize against the new Castratti - I mean Democrtas, Progressives. Tell Obama and Rahm Emmanuel (Zeke, too) that this is America, we take care of ourselves. If they like the Euro trash models of healthcare and the Canadian style, then they should move there. Yeah Rahm - boy, ......I goy a beef with you, gonna do something about it? I challenge you to a Rochambeau contest. Hey were you not man enough to actually carry a gun and try to shoot somebody while you were "volunteering" for the IDF? I see a future as a diesel mechanic for myou.
I welcome Democrats to come to the protests on 9/12....might give you something to do since you don't work.
Sounds like someone has got his panties all in a knot. That's the spirit, caldwell, kill all them brown-skinned and Jewish people running the country and let some REAL Americans show ya how it's DONE.
Oh Yeah. That's right. You guys did that for the last eight years. Last month of the Bush presidency, 741,00 jobs lost, the worst recorded job loss in 50 years. Great Job!
The quite, somber dissent is no longer heard in America; hasn't been for quite some time. The established political machines of both the right and the left are very comfortable with restrained middle class complaints, since it allows them to control and channel the conversation. Status quo is no longer acceptable to the middle class. The silent majority is waking up and both parties better start listening to the message, regardless of how it is delivered. Dems are making a huge mistake in trying to marginalize anyone who disagrees with them. Contrary to their delusions, it was the independent middle class that brought them to power.
"Dems are making a huge mistake in trying to marginalize anyone who disagrees with them."
Um---how do you explain those showing up at town halls and making discourse on the issues impossible? Shouting down everyone else's voice and questions seems to me to be the very definition of marginalizing anyone who disagrees with them.
Again, someone confuses volume with majority.
An A for creative writing, much like explaining how a car works by describing the paint job. Radio talk show hosts only have surface appeal, much like their philosophy. Fortunately the river runs much deeper for most thinking people and the out of control politicians will bear the brunt at the polls.
where's the story about the union thugs beating up a black conservative in St. Louis last night?
At www.fictionalstories.com? Perhaps at www.wingnutmyths.net?
Don't forget World Nut Daily.
I'm a union member, and our union's so weak we can't afford thugs. Hey, you don't suppose that tales of union thuggery are something from the way past?
They're remembering those bad old days when unions fought a bloody battle to get us the 40 hour work week. Damn them!
flyoverland: I watched the video at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y5Q3p6jClQM.
It sure looks to me like somebody attacked a SEIU union member, who was laying on the ground. Other union members then went to his rescue.
There were several blacks there, including at least one SEIU union member.
There is no way you can tell from the video who started the altercation - it is already in progress at the beginning of the video.
The St. Louis Post-Dispatch article (http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/stories.nsf/laworder/story/0470FEB32 19207458625760B001142AC?OpenDocument) does not give any information about who started the fight. I would not trust any of the conservative web sites reporting on this event.
a Post Dispatch reporter was arrested for not moving out of the way during the fight. The only people arrested were the union people.
Keep wishing it didn't happen.
http://www.kmov.com/localnews/stories/kmov-stlouis-090809-tea-party-glad ney.c44273c4.html?npc
Wow, a conservative intellectual with dignity....I figured they were all extinct by now...
The Republican party has been projecting itself as the party of delusional religious zealots and screaming blowhards for the past decade or so, and their unwillingness to condemn the tactics and actions of extreme-right shock jocks and groups like the teabaggers are the prime reason why educated middle-class independents have placed their votes with the Democrats.
I could be swayed to vote Republican if the party philosophy started moving more towards rational, moderate viewpoints like Mr. Batchelor's. Until then, given abysmal candidates like Sarah Palin (who personifies the worst of the anti-intellect, blind faith hate speech spewing from the mouths of Limbaugh & co.) my vote will stay with the Dems.
Reminds me of a certin ignorant old lady at a certain John McCain rally. To suggest that these people are not Republican is ludicrious.
As Bill Mahr put it, "in today's world not all Conservatives are racist but it is a good bet that all racists are Conservative".
AMEN!
So this is the strategy liberals are employing to unite the country in "Change"? If you're not on board with socialism and handing over enormous control of the economy and your personal life to Washington bureaucrats, you're called every name under the sun... I understand it was a hard last 8 years having your patriotism questioned and your civil liberties thrashed, but there must be a better way to get your points across. All this name-calling is ridiculously immature and shows the weakness of your positions. I'm, quite frankly, sick of seeing anyone that disagrees with Obama the God painted as a racist, whack job, nutcase, loony toon, moron. You're hate filled venom is turning the middle against you and will drive them right back to the GOP. Don't forget, you won the last 2 elections because of the Republicans war on intellectualism -- you're going to need to start formulating articulate positions that aren't laced with personal attacks if you hope to keep them. I personally hope you don't.
johngaltmateyko, who are you talking about??? It is the party of the conservatives that are spewing hate and they are the ones doing the most name calling. Instead of thoughtful educated intelligent discussions about changes fear mongerers like Rush and cooks like Glen Beck are not helping. But acting like the protests that are going on all over the country is helping the cause is insane. Why have the repubs not offered any real alternatives to healthcare reform? I am 42 and have 4 kids that have never know insurance and I am a tax paying legal working citizen of this country and don't believe it is a priviledge to have basic healthcare! I am so sick of the repubs fear mongering everthing under the sun to keep everyone in check!
So you are 42 and have 4 kids and have never known insurance? You call yourself an adult? An adult would see to it that she had insurance for her kids, she would provide it herself. An adult would go about seeing to that and not relying on the government to provide it. You do want your sons to grow up to be men....don't you?
I forgot, you are an Obama supporter which means that you want womb to the tomb care no matter what. Hey do you need a house...a car maybe? Whoopdedoo, you pay taxes, so do I , so do those protestors. That mere fact gives them the right to call a politician any name they want. Provide insurance for your kids is YOUR obligation...not mine, not Obama's and not the government's. If you can't get insurance, stop eating all the Cheetoh's, drinking the cokes and cut down on the sugar and McDonald's. You might find you have money left over for insurance. Oh yeah, sell the Wii and X box as well. Buy New Balance instead of Nike and go to Wal mart a little more often. While you are at it maybe you should try shopping for insurance. It always amazes me when people say they can't afford insurance. I got laid off two years ago and the first thing I did was go shopping for insurance for my wife and three kids....guess what I found it and it took care of the basics as well as hospitalization. The truth is, you are intimidated by insurance and do not want take the time to fill out the forms.
LIVE UP TO YOUR OBLIGATIONS AND BUY HEALTH INSURANCE FOR YOU KIDS -at least.
"You're hate filled venom is turning the middle against you and will drive them right back to the GOP."
Anyone looking for a classic example of projection need look no further.
So, johngalimateyko -- you claim that "All this name-calling is ridiculously immature" -- and in the very next sentence you refer to President Obama as "Obama the God"?
If you're dumb enough to contradict yourself, you don't need liberals to label you as a whack-job, nutcase, loony-toon or moron. It's not name-calling if you really are stupid.
Don't forget your 8 years off Atwatering and Rovian harrassment of Clinton, you sick, delusional, sheltered, no nothing about real life mindless child. Go to bed now sonny.
Walking home yesterday evening, I passed by Union Square in NYC. I saw "Stop Obama" signs on the street. Some rather hesitant ( I thought) well dressed mulatto men were standing by the signs and one white man called out to me "What do you think of Obama's health care plan?". "I think its great" I replied." Then he pleaded, "But he wants to kill the elderly". It was clear from the pathetic lilt to his voice, that he himself knew that was shear nonsense. I laughed and waived him off.
There is something strange and unnerving about this campaign against universal healthcare which is calling on our fears yet again so that we prevent ourselves from helping our nation. I keep thinking about the lies and inuendos that got us enveloped in the Iraq war and all the billions of dollars spent and lives lost because of irrational and unfounded fear. I pray that healthcare will not once again be drowned out by irrational fears cleverly planted in the minds of the American people, and playing on their worst reptilian tribal and racist subconscious drives. I admire Pres. Obama, although I do not always agree with him. What I admire most, is that he calls on our higher selves and approaches these difficult subjects with reason.
With five different bills circulating in Congress, pray tell what specific aspects of the plan you consider to be great?
splinter: Some 22,000 uninsured Americans die each year. I would consider any bill that covers these people to be a great improvement over what we have now.
There is no one bill that we are critiquing right now, but so far I think all bills agree that it will lower premiums by providing competion to keep the insurance companies honest. They have ripped off the american people, and I'm waiting for my settlement check. Now, these bills also provide that no longer can american's be denied for pre-existing conditions. That's good, everone wants that. Digitalizing medical records will provide efficiency, but to me this is all tinkering around the edges. Until each doctor and medical provider streamlines processes and costs, bills fairly based on agreed upon fee schedules and reimbursement rates, there will still be high costs. The bill will have to have a public option, and I think it's central to reform. This is the same as medicare that our senior citizens enjoy. Why do they get it and we can't have it too? That doesn't make any sense. The bill will save our economy from an unsustainable model that is choking the budget of the american people.
I refuse to spend one half of my budget on healthcare within ten years. But that is what these people, these thugs, are fighting for. They are fighting against the will of the american people to be treated fairly. They don't know about any of what I just wrote, because they don't want to. I can't believe they aren't experiencing these problems with their own families' healthcare. Because the insurance companies do not descriminate, if you have a pulse they will try to under pay your bills and get around their responsibilities.
"What I admire most, is that he calls on our higher selves and approaches these difficult subjects with reason."
Amen.
As a low income sr. who paid into medicare for 40 yrs. with a chronic condition, I am concerned that medicare benefits will be cut for "cost savings" and will vehemently voice these concerns if given the opportunity. I am not a nut case and find it very disingenuous to 1. Accuse anyone of behavior any different than that of many during the election and related to various issues. 2. To not address the malpractice problems which are at the very least, a good chunk of the high cost of our system. Maybe, just maybe, people really do care about getting it right and our congress people reading what they are signing. Maybe, just maybe, we don't need someone else to tell us how we should feel about all this, whether it be a group or the president. llogan
It is likely that Medicare benefits will no longer pay for useless medical treatments, but why would you want to have a treatment that has been shown to not help you (or worse, even hurt you)?
Otherwise Medicare will not change - both parties realize the voting power of senior citizens like you and me.
By the way, malpractice accounts for less than 1% of health care costs, so in no way is it "a good chunk of the high cost of our system." And without it, how do you hold medical professionals accountable for the estimated 100,000 deaths each year caused by medical errors?
Stop listening to Rush Limbaugh and Fox news. Your life will be more relaxed if you do.
And you might have a chance to hear all this if you stop the ignorant and uninformed from yelling and screaming at every meeting. they are huring everyone who really wants things explained to them about healthcare.
This comment has been removed by The Daily Beast's editors.
by their works you will know them
it's all well and good to say it's not the Republicans, but why then do they sit on the sidelines and chear it on. Thier leadership, if indeed they are not aiding and abetting) should be putting a stop to this. Someone is eventually going to DIE. Who then is responsable? Rush the Blowhard? Glen the grim weeper? Let's see some leadership from the GOP and have a real conversation about a very important subject.
Does anyone remember Henry II of England asking "Will no one rid me of this turbulent priest?" before the assassination of Thomas Becket, the Archbishop of Canterbury, in 1162?
Rush, Bill, Glenn, and Sean are asking "Will no one rid me of this turbulent health care bill?" If I were Obama, I would be very cautious...
How do you compare Rush , Bill , Glenn, & Sean to Henry II ?
oldpunk: They are setting up an environment of fear and hatred in which others will do the dirty work for them. Remember Dr. Tiller? "Tiller the baby killer"?
The GOP & its leaders lack the moral courage necessary to criticize the worst elements of the opposition to Obama on issues like health care reform. Political expediency is their only guiding principle & so for them the end (damaging your political opponents) always justifies the means.
The GOP is doing the same thing by congressional behavioral standards. Just because they spend hours reading bills and voting and revoting and revoting on the revote doesn't mean that they're not throwing their own tantrum too.
While I don't underestimate the sway of ignorant voters after eight years of President Bush, in terms of the debate, I really don't think it makes that much of a difference whether it's GOP pundits or GOP congressmen fueling these temper tantrums. They're all connected, they all strategize together (just look at Richard Hohlt's role in the Valerie Plame scandal).
I never cease to be amazed at the audacity of GOP. They lose the election so badly the Dems get a supermajority, so the GOP wastes hours of the Senate's time, don't actually propose any concrete alternatives (or if they do, they propose a "fiscally responsible alternative" without actually bothering to figure out how much it will cost), they infect their constituents with a rabid fervor based on lies, who then go in and hoot and holler so that the rest of the population can't discuss or ask questions about democratic reforms, and then accuse the Democrats of "stifling democracy"?
Do you need a definition for "stifle" or "democracy"? You clearly have no idea what either one of those words mean.
we will never be truly free until we stop letting them have any input at all. They have proven themselves to be traitors to the american people. Not only that, but they think it's just fine and dandy to lie all day long. Anything to hurt Obama because they feel so inadequate (because they are).
so union member who called in only acorn were republican and nancy pelosi who said that some had swatzhi was republican too.
http://gatewaypundit.blogspot.com/2009/08/shock-video-dems-sneak-union-thug s-into.html
i know what this health system can do cause my friend in england who have this system can be in hospital one day after baby bec. not enough money.
"we have to rush stimulus "i didn't sayit obama did .was never read and unemploymemt above 8 which they said wouldn't happen.
i didn't like when bush had bailout too btw which obama voted for when he was in senate so he part at fault of the 1.3 trillion he bring up. so i guess bush fault the 1 trillion added in last half year by obama right!
see difference i like bush i can disagree with him just like i can agree with the democrats when didn't pass bill of concealed weapon across state line.
can you ever disagree with obama even if you like him or protest him are not allowed anymore but war protest were and 60's protest were
melenie: Stop watching Fox News and get a life.
...and learn how to spell you name correctly.
http://gatewaypundit.blogspot.com/2009/08/shock-video-dems-sneak-union-thug s-into.html
wow so the union members are republicans and so is acorn.
nancy pelosi saying "they had swatztiskas."
harry reid "they are disrupting the democratic process
barbara boxer "well dressed like ppl who were in florida by recount"
who is half baked now
People that don't use punctuation or caps.
Your posts are almost unintelligible.
CherokeeGirl has it right. The GOP have proven to be traitors to America on more than one occasion. If the Party wasn't so narrow-minded and monolithic perhaps some Republicans might have objected to Bushboy's inane and unwarranted invasion of Iraq. Perhaps some might have voted against his tax cuts for the rich, which has drained the treasury of $1 trillion with nothing to show for it. Perhaps some Republicans might have objected to the Medicare monstrosity they passed with the donut hole, prohibiting Medicare from getting bids on pharmaceuticals and having to accept the higher prices demanded by Big Pharma.
Where have the Republicans been when the American people needed them? Probably at "C" Street swapping extra-marital sex stories.
Ever wonder about the smell? You know that foul order emanating in the place you write from....
Back up your $1 trillion claim. Name the number of Dems that opposed war in Iraq. Realize that you are a one-eyed hypocritical party hack that preaches how great Medicare is in one post and calls it "monstrosity" in the other. Be grateful that check from moveon.org has cleared.
Oh, and they were swapping extra-marital stories with Clinton. I was there. He was very explicit.
My, splinter----you do a pretty good imitation of a "one-eyed party hack" yourself.
Splinter:
Periscopes post is factually correct. Don't be lazy, the info is out there. Look it up yourself! Most of us are tired of typing out factual posts that you righties request but then do not even bother to read or refuse to believe.
splinter: People in 2002 who even considered going against the war in Iraq were demonized as traitors and Un-American. This, when combined with the lies that the Bush administration told about Iraq (weapons of mass destruction, anybody?), it would have taken a very courageous politician to vote against the war.
That foul smell you mention comes from you and conservatives like you. Having lost power through democratic elections, you now want to force your views on America by protests and violence. Long may you and your Republicans languish in obscurity...
Splinter:
Unfortunately for you, and for me, I just sent money to Moveon. I wish it was the other way around, but people like you make me want to send more, and I can, and I will.
Splinter, just to be perfectly clear, she did not equivocate on Medicare: Medicare can work; part D - the prescription monstrosity - was the big pharma giveaway/expansion of entitlement program, with not a thought as to how to pay for it.
Don't you wish we'd privatized Social Security?
Thank you.
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