Politics
More PoliticsA Muslim-Bashing Campaign for Congress
Benjamin Sarlin is Washington correspondent for The Daily Beast. He previously covered New York City politics for The New York Sun and has worked for talkingpointsmemo.com.
A Minnesota attorney is using virulent attacks on Islam in an attempt to unseat one of just two Muslims in Congress. Benjamin Sarlin talks to Rep. Keith Ellison and his challenger about a campaign that’s raising eyebrows.
As America’s first Muslim congressman, Rep. Keith Ellison has been a target for anti-Islamic sentiment from the moment he took the oath of office. Scratch that—from before he took his oath of office, when Rep. Virgil Goode (R-VA) criticized Ellison for planning to use a Koran for the ceremony and warned that “in the next century we will have many more Muslims in the United States if we do not adopt the strict immigration policies that I believe are necessary to preserve the values and beliefs traditional to the United States of America.”
Now Ellison is facing an anti-Islamic campaign from an independent challenger, criminal attorney Lynne Torgerson, who is bidding to unseat him in 2010. While Ellison, who sits in an overwhelmingly Democratic district, has little to fear politically from Torgerson, the challenger is raising eyebrows with her inflammatory language.
“Who is Keith Ellison? He is my opposing candidate for the Fifth Congressional District seat. Keith Ellison is a Muslim, a person who was raised Christian and converted to Islam.”
A large section of her Web site is devoted to outlining her views on Islam, including snippets like this one: “And, what do I know of Islam? Well, I know of 9/11. Nineteen (19) men from Saudi Arabia, all Muslim, hi-jacked planes, and flew into the two (2) World Trade Towers murdering thousands of people, and tried to fly into our Pentagon, and some believe they also tried to fly an airplane into our White House. From this, what I perceive is Islam conducting an act of war against my country. ”
Torgerson goes on to blame the “teachings of Islam” for the Fort Hood shooting, before asking: “Who is Keith Ellison? He is my opposing candidate for the Fifth Congressional District seat. Keith Ellison is a Muslim, a person who was raised Christian and converted to Islam.”
Asked about how he planned to respond to Torgerson’s campaign, Ellison told The Daily Beast that he would do his best to stress tolerance.
“I don’t believe in ignoring it, because I believe any time you have tough economic conditions and any time you have an event like 9/11, you have the possibility that people will not embrace the best within the community,” he said. “My campaign’s all about puling people toward our better selves, our nobler selves, the better part of our heritage. Thomas Jefferson and George Washington and Benjamin Franklin all stood for the principles of religious tolerance and inclusion.”
Besides, he added: “Quite frankly, I’ve had worse attacks than this.”
Nonetheless, the campaign has attracted the attention of the Council on American-Islamic Relations, one of the country’s premier Muslim advocacy groups. A recent press release by the group’s Minnesota chapter mentioned Torgerson’s candidacy and called on Minnesota leaders to condemn her language. But the group’s national legislative director, Corey Saylor, told The Daily Beast that the group is cautious about giving Torgerson too much publicity in rebutting her statements.
“We’re paying attention, obviously,” Saylor said. “But our collective guess is Minnesotans will reject her message as being bigoted. So unless she starts showing some rise in the polls, we’re just going to occasionally address her in passing in a press release.”
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historyforgotten
The Nazis are rearing their ugly heads in America. They support the Blackwater Religious Re-Education Camps. The Republican Conservatives worship their Golden Idol, Glenn Beck. The Grand Inquisitor, Dick Cheney, leads his 'Knights', into a Religious War for Greed.
balanced-being
While freedom of religion is important, freedom from religion is even more important. Americans, who accept the principle [mostly] of separation of church and state, are often ignorant of the contrast with Islam's view of this subject. Christ was outside the power structure. Mohammad was the ruler and spiritual head of his empire. For Muslims there is no separation. Both work together as a unit to provide an ordered society. This is why Muslim countries are controlled remotely by the religious leaders. Democratic concepts, people electing effective leaders, is a concept that will be lost if the Muslim religion becomes a significant force in American politics. Be aware of the truth of the saying, "Democracy - one man, one vote. Islam - one man, one vote, one time."
justlooking
Didn't God tell George Bush to invade Iraq?
whipmawhopma
balanced-being - Well said.
jherndon
Your knowledge of Islam, Muslims and Muslim countries is woefully lacking. Many of the leaders in Muslim countries were put in place and propped up initially by the British and French, and now the U.S. The wahabis who came into power with the Saud family were supported in conquering the Arabian peninsula by the British, who wanted to defeat the nationalist movement there. No space for a complete lesson here, though. Islam is actually a very democratic religion and functions very well in the American system. The last thing 99% of Muslims want is one ruler telling them what to do, because they will never agree on the smaller issues. Please stop getting your education at Fox news.
Richter
Sorry, balanced-being, but you simply don't know what you are talking about. There are 1.3 billion Muslims on the planet, and your implied assumption that all majority Muslim nations are the same is as naive -- if not bigoted -- as the notion that all Christian majority nation are the same. The most populous Islamic nation in the world is Indonesia -- a thriving democracy that in fact has itself been victimized by Islamic fundamentalist terrorists. Of course when you use as nebulous a phrase as "controlled remotely by religious leaders," you can pretty much prove anything you like. George W. Bush had tremendously close ties to Christian fundamentalists during his two terms in office. Would you therefore say he was "controlled remotely by religious leaders?" I suspect not -- in which case you are guilty of hypocrisy.
pgbsan
What are you even talking about? You do realize that Turkey -- a 95% Muslim country -- is a democracy, right? Maybe not the most stable but the people there expect to be able to elect their leaders periodically; an expectation the military is even afraid of.
To call Christianity more compatible with democracy is idiotic. For the first 1700 years of Christianity, there were exactly zero democratic Christian republics. The closest things were the Magna Carta parliament in England -- which only gave semi-democratic rights to the "haves" -- and the colonial councils in America. Before then, European monarchs -- Christians ruling in Christian lands -- proclaimed themselves and their progeny rulers by divine right and directly controlled the church on their lands. In your words, "there was no separation" effectively between church and state. The papacy ruled Rome and central Italy directly; the French started their own line of popes for a while.
Seriously, read a history book or two before making such ignorant statements.
tedpikul
Jesus was outside of the power structure 2000 years ago. Over 50 million Christian Americans - Evangelicals, Catholics, etc. - regularly use their right to vote to express the will of Jesus as they understand it.
Wong23
You generalize from your specific baises which is the classic description of bigotry Worse, what facts you do attempt are wrong. Turkey and Indonesia are Islamic countries with secular governments
whipmawhopma
balanced-being is correct. His wording might not be precise, but he's pretty much on target. There is no separation between church and state in classical Islam, meaning as it was taught by Mohammed. The church is the state and state is the church, except that there is no church and there is no state, as it's all Islam or submission to God. Everything. Muslims don't live by man's law or their own but by the word of God as reported by Mohammed. At least in classical Islam.
The entire realm of Islam is but one country in classical Islam, and places like Turkey, Indonesia, Saudi Arabia, etc, these are all false divisions controlled by false rulers who will be overthrown or redeemed so that Islam can return to being a unified state, this being the Caliphate as established by Mohammed. So what is done in Turkey and elsewhere, this means nothing.
And unlike many other religions, Islam doesn't have any clergy or priests or anything like that. The religious authorities are really all lawyers, and the book of law is the Koran. There is no other law in classical Islam, nor any other authority for government, because government is based on the teachings and examples of the prophet, and then the subsequent interpretations of those by Islamic lawyers.
I highly recommend reading 'Destiny Disrupted' by Tamim Ansary. But in the meantime, here are some Islamic sources...
http://articles.challengeyoursoul.com/index.php?categoryId=2&articleId=6
"The idea of Jama'ah in Islam is unique. Islam does not separate the religious aspect of the society from the social and the political aspect. On the contrary, in Islam, all aspects of the society are bound by the discipline, or the dynamic of Shareeah. Sharee'ah is the law, it is the source of empowerment, it is the source of legislation, it is the driving force of the community. Thus, the community is driven (guided) by the Sharee'ah. Every part of it is governed and dependent upon the Sharee'ah. Therefore, the religion is law, and the law is religion."
http://www.islam101.com/politics/politicalsystem.htm
"This principle of the unity of Allah totally negates the concept of the legal and political independence of human beings, individually or collectively. No individual, family, class or race can set themselves above Allah. Allah alone is the Ruler and His commandments are the Law."
http://www.islamfortoday.com/cleland04.htm
"Islamic government is a system of government which follows the laws and principles of the Quran and the Sunna of Muhammad. Government is the responsibility of all humanity, especially of those people who understand that they are the 'caliphs' of God, not the privilege of a ruling class of theocrats. Islamic government enforces the law of equality and it establishes the rule of justice. It is always based upon consultation. Muslims believe that only when this system is established can there be justice and harmony in society."
Honchos
Jama'ah means "community" or "gathering". It is used sometimes to talk about the brotherhood of Muslims worldwide and there are some fringe groups who envision a united Muslim nation, but that is not the standard usage. Typically it's used in the same way Christians might talk about their "Christian brothers and sisters" in areas where they've sent missionaries. It's not nearly as politicized as whipma indicates.
Sure, you can say there's no separation between church and state in classical Islam but you'd have to admit that the same thing goes for classical Christianity as can be seen through pretty much all of European history. Separation between church and state is a very new idea, historically speaking, that is under constant attack in any country with a sizable religious population.
whipmawhopma
Honchos - I beg to differ. Jesus said his kingdom was not of this earth and that we should render unto Caesar what is Caesar's. This included paying taxes to Caesar, and the ability to tax the individual is the definition of government authority, since everything else comes from it. Jesus made it clear that he was not there to govern. Likewise St Paul gave instruction that we, as Christians, should obey those authorities put over us, which included that of the Roman Empire in its pre-Christianized days, and had it existed at the time this would have applied to the Caliphate as well. Many Christians served the Ottoman Empire without any religious qualms, and in fact some preferred it to rule by 'Christian' rulers.
Mohammad seems to have thought it best to combine religion and government in one entity, or rather to not divide them up, perhaps understanding that in essence the two are one and the same in a well ordered and harmonious society, be it a city or something larger. Whatever one believes about whether or not Mohammad really was God's prophet, he was a community organizer, concerned with the plight of the poor, the widowed, the orphaned, fighting against corruption and against the power that the wealthy had over everyone else. Like Jesus he was moved in his heart by the plight of human beings. Unlike Jesus he felt the sword had its place in fixing things to be as they should be.
As for what happened later with Christianity and it's becoming the state religion in various forms for various nations, I would hold that to a large degree what was called Christianity in this context was something else using the brand name and a form of it, but not the genuine article. Instead it became a tool to gather power in the hands of politicians who referred to themselves as princes, kings and emperors. A similar thing happened in Islam, about the time of the third or fourth Caliphate, with Islam drifting off course from what Mohammad had intended. I am doing this from memory, so I am a little hazy on whether it started it's drift in the third or fourth.
Going back to what balanced-being said about democracy. I was thinking about that last night, and recalled that democracy isn't something to be found in either the Bible or the Koran. It comes from somewhere elsewhere, and I doubt that God would recognize majority rule as a valid way to govern, at least to the degree that it involves him. That's a little tricky to say, since as the creator God is the owner of everything, including having power over everything, therefore everything involves him, or at least it looks that way to many Christians or Muslims, hence the desire to drag God into everything. I get a little lost when I think about it.
Nevertheless, root level Christianity and root level Islam had two quite different perspectives on church and state. Root level Christianity respected the state, but was not also the state, whereas root level Islam church and state were one and the same. That in itself doesn't make one better than the other, but it does suggest that in a majority Islamic nation that the law becomes like that to be found in the Koran, because God's law will always trump man's law.
How that translates in modern times I can't really say, but it seems like the Islamic world is having a harder time with the jump to the secularization of government than the Christian world. I think it has to do with the difference I describe above.
ponykeg
assuming for the sake of argument that that is true, it goes to show exactly why we should have very strong separation between church and state. But, this goes for the christian church, judaism, etc. as well. When we keep religious life completely out of governance, we don't have to worry that any particular religion will take over, as it should be.
whipmawhopma
ponykeg - I agree. A theocracy is a bad thing no matter what religion or religion-like ism (communism for example) is running it. Even if it's a decent religion the power corrupts it just like it does the politicians.
MeravL
This is sad.
Many in the USA never read the Koran. I suggest you all to do so. It is available in English in every public library. The "religion of peace" the so-called "democratic religion" as one commented here... Really? Which part is peace-preaching in the Koran? the one that says that Christians and Jews could redeem themselves ONLY if they accept Allah as the only god and Mohammed as his prophet? The other option is death to all infidels (AKA. you and me)
What even more sad is that Ms. Torgerson is still trying to win a campaign over 9/11. And if Mr. Ellison will continue to preach for tolerance ,he will win. Because tolerance is the great word everybody likes in a democratic world. BUT what many are failing to understand is that in the name of tolerance and freedom of religion, the Muslims are abusing our rights. Once they are in majority, once they are in the house, you will not be able to maintain your lives as you know then today. Women will be forced to cover themselves, not allowed in public by themselves, not allowed to dates or go out and forget about a drink.... and that's the easy part. Do you want to have Shari'ah laws? Don't say "this will never happen hear". Take a look at Europe. They tolerated so much of the Muslims demands, and got what in return? Bombing in London and Spain.
Read the Koran. Know what it is about and don't take my word or Ellison's for it. Believe me, it is not a difficult book to read.
escomments
The stock knee jerk Liberal reaction. Here, let me help you. If you are Conservative, You are:
"An un-educated, anti-elitist, racist, bigoted, incestuous, family tree don't fork, Limbaugh listening, Beck Listening, O'rielly Watching, Hannity Watching, Faux News Watching, Neanderthalian, Greedy, Air Polluting, Insurance Company shill, Petroleum Company shill, Wingnut"
Does that about cover it, historyforgotten?
LibsRule4ever
You're good, that is EXACTLY correct. Only it's not a knee-jerk reaction, it is an accurate assessment of what the once proud and honorable Republican Party has become.
schwelm
You forgot "Jesus freaks".
gak001
While I agree that knee-jerk reactions are pretty much all unfounded, I don't see too many liberals out their in white hoods trying to defend some backwards way of life.
viking54
Dear escomments:
To quote Sarah Palin:
Stop Making Things Up
tedpikul
Sweet pea, prove us wrong.
roger37
You forgot "mouthbreathing."
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Sajwert
escomments, you might have touched on some parts of what being a conservative means, but you didn't include those who are educated but prefer to believe that faith in a god has more standing than anything shown by science to be true.
You also didn't include the educated (high school at least) who believe that Darwin's theory of evolution is a lie, but thinks that every word in a book called the Bible is the actual word of some unseen god.
You didn't include the educated (college, higher degrees) who preach daily about the power of faith over reason and science, who believe that our government would be better run and more justly run were everyone to become a Christian.
You didn't include the educated that would have us believe that AIDS is a curse by this unseen god on those who are homosexual.
You didn't include the educated that would allow creationism taught in schools along side evolution and have the nerve to insist that both sides should have equal consideration.
Not every conservative is a redneck in a pickup truck with a gun in a rack at the back of his seat, smoking a cigarette, swilling a beer, and looking for a minority to tie to and drag behind his pickup truck.
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dailybeasty
You misspelled "sieg".
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rasputinsir
The Nazis were Moslems at heart.They were alligned w/the moslem terrorists in Yugoslavia.When Christianity&other religions have full rights&are not assasinated for their non conformity w/that violent religion the sun will die out by that time.
dcurtis
Muslims should be bashed. The extreme faction the most -- with the others passively standing by not condemning the extreme elements being bashed as well, being made to feel very uncomfortable living here apart from their condemnation of the extremists. Keep the bashing up. And you call this playing dirty, given 911, USS Cole, etc. etc? VERY strange and dangerous perspective. Why do we allow people to live here that hate America and what most Americans stand for? Bash, Baby, Bash. VERY good points are made by the commentor below. Reality is a very good place to live in. And for all you Beck, etc. haters, if you had to choose, think about whether you'd want him around your children or an Islamic terrorist. Please, can some common sense prevail for a change?
LutfiUSMC
The Nazi and the Klu klux Klan , have changed there wardrobe from the white hoods, and Swastika to a suite's ties and dresses , but dispensing the same ugly message, maybe we should all focused on the danger that we have within from these small minded imbecile who call them self human being and to any one who support them for the wrong reason,
escomments
You mean radical Muslims?
theschmooze
Freedom of Religion? As long as it is Christianity I guess.
truthiness2
How stupid is it to have a Moslem take oath of office using the Bible. The oath would have more weight if taken using the book one thinks is holy. In the case of Moslems it is the Koran. If it was up to me, elected official would be sworn on the holy book of their own religion to make sure that they take their oath seriously.
room34
Sad, sad, sad. I live in Keith Ellison's district, and am proud to have him represent MN-5. He's a strong progressive voice for our district, and he's a great positive representative of what Islam really means for America. The good news is that Keith Ellison's seat in the House is about as safe as could be -- he's done an outstanding job representing his constituents and will easily win re-election. The bad news, and the great irony, is that Michele Bachmann (whose district is adjacent to Ellison's) and her ilk (Torgerson included, apparently, though honestly I'd never heard of her before this) are promoting ostensibly "Christian" values that are as twisted and dangerous as what they think Islam represents.
Nusrat
room34 - just curious, where does your congressman stand on the issue of gay marriage?
wintersport
He's a supporter of equal protection under the law in a pluralistic society. Something his opponent has issues with. Seems she's a better hardliner than Keith is.
mahank
Keith is an ardent supporter of gay rights, including gay marriage...
misha1000
What did Christians do on November 9, 1938?
What did Timothy McVeigh, a Catholic influenced by Christian Identity, do?
And most Crusades ended in pogroms.
innocentcitizen
misha you shouldn't get high before you write this idiotic stuff. of course no one knows what you're talking about. i assume your talking about nazis on nov 9 1938 not christians. timothy mcveigh wasn't bombing in the name of his religion, he was just a sick little monkey. crusades? what? if you're going to defend islam, try to come up with something not on a 3rd grade level
schwelm
If ignorance is bliss, you must be very happy, innocentcitizen. Just because you don't know what happened on 11-9-38, doesn't mean no one else knows, as you claim. It was Kristallnacht. Here is a little fact about the Holocaust that people in the US refuse to face. If the first people to be exterminated are the Atheists (communists) and the next are the Jews, who exactly is doing the exterminating? I'll give you a hint. There are not a whole lot of Muslims, Buddhists or Hindus in central Europe. Here is another hint. The Nazis had stamped on their belt buckles "Gott Mit Uns" (God with us).
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innocentcitizen
to squelch and bullcrap, you just made my point for me, i said she must be referring to nazis not christians. you idiot racists think that just because the nzis were white germans, they must all be christians. they weren't, they were nazis. bullcrap, you say mcveigh was influenced by islam to kill children. thanks for making my argument for me dumbasses
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rasputinsir
The Crusades were a response to the invasion of Spain&the rest of Europe.The murdering Moslem' s got very close to the Vatican.They last invaded by turkish armies in the late 1600's
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cathay
My God, you're an idiot. This is what happens when ignorant people start parroting what little misinformation they've gleaned over the years rather than arguing from a point of actual knowledge of FACTS.
Since nobody told you and you were too incurious to properly research the examples you use, I feel compelled to enlighten you.
1. The nazis despised Christianity and NEVER once invoked it in their assaults on Jews and other groups. The closest Hitler and his followers ever came to "religion" was the occult which they studied and pursued its secret knowledge incessantly.
2. McVeigh was not motivated by any misplaced Christian fervor, but rather by misplaced frustration and bitterness with our federal government. While he was an admitted agnostic, he did'nt care for any particular religion.
3. The 1st Crusade was a long overdue response to centuries of Muslim aggression and Islamic imperialism
The first Crusade was launched in 1095, a full 457 AFTER Muslims conquered Jerusalem persecuting Christians and burning down their churches. 380 years AFTER Muslim invaders swarmed across Spain with a superior military force and subjugating the indigenous Christian population for the next 7 centuries. 363 years AFTER Muslim armies first (oh yes they tried again in 792) attempted to invade France. The list is endless.
All religions have had ugly episodes but most are open to reform and understand that respect and tolerance are a two way street. Islam still does not accept this! The West is still defending itself from 1400 years of Islamic aggression and imperialism, but that reality (despite the overwhelming empirical evidence) is lost on the ignorant, the anti Western Civilization, anti Christianity crowd. People like you notice with laser like vision whenever a Christian fanatic or someone who may have been raised by Christian parents commits a crime or trespasses on the rights of others but somehow you're inexplicably blind to the weekly atrocities and abuses committed by Muslims. Hypocrisy is thy name.
Torque
Cathay, your first point is demonstrably and easily refuted.
"I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator: by defending myself against the Jew, I am fighting for the work of the Lord."
Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf, vol. 1, ch. 2
Simpleton
http://nobeliefs.com/nazis.htm
cathay
@Torque,
While Hitler did in fact mention Christianity ..or his notion of it in Mein Kampf, don't forget that his Secretary and high ranking nazi Martin Bormann, also declared that "National Socialism [Nazism] and Christianity are irreconcilable"
Another Hitler associate Hermann Rauschning declared "One is either a Christian or a German. You can't be both."
In addition, Hitler declared Nazism the state religion and the Bible was replaced by Mein Kampf in the schools.
In 1933, Hitler said, 'It is through the peasantry that we shall really be able to destroy Christianity because there is in them a true religion rooted in nature and blood.'" The list goes on.
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misha1000
@historyforgotten: I associate Christianity with suffering.
Google how Ted Haggard harrassed non-Christians in Colorado Springs. He actually sent congregants to homes of people he thought were Wiccans, and they hounded about ten people to sell their homes, and move away.
Google forced baptisms in Colorado Springs, and how Jewish families were harrassed, especially by the Cornerstone Baptist Church.
truthiness2
And, what do you associate Islam with?
whipmawhopma
That's a loaded question.
TheRealFerrari
The bettr question is what do you associate christianity with?
truthiness2
Hey "TheRealFerrari", misha1000 already said that associates Christianity with suffering.
Silent though on the "religion of Peace".
Rakiba
I think Ellison is a stand-up guy and I would probably vote for him. AND, there are some issues with Islam that needs to be addressed.
dontBugMe
Funny, the reporters fails to mention that Ellison tried to load Homeland Security committees with Islamist interns to spy. Now how is that a "small number" of terrorists can't be defeated by many large nation states around the world ? In addition to good normal Muslims you have bunch of Armani Islamist like Ellison who are loyal to Ummah not to US.
They are always trying their best to thwart with cliches of "human rights", and racism when Muslim world is the most racist of all in treating the minorities(Dhimmis), women, and gays.
I think Islamist have more commonality with Nazis as we had were Hanzar Muslim SS division in WWII in Balkans and support of Mufti of Jerusalem.
From history Muslims were responsible for enslaving Africans and selling them to Whites, killing 10s of Millions of Hindus, Armenians, Jews, Christians besides enslaving Whites in Mediterranean ships leading to first battle between US and Muslims in 19th century.
Please try to get you facts straight before mouthing off. That is unless you are Armani Islamist disguised writing using non Muslim names all in service of Ummah.
DrMJG1
Ok, would you please cite any sources to validate your first paragraph. I suspect this is just a repeating of a rumor.
I am currently working as an expat is a country with a very LARGE muslim population. Here there is no discrimination against any religion. You are trying to equate the laws of a country (Saudi Arabia, best friends of Bush) with the tenants of a religion.
Sources on your selling of slaves as well. History books, pages and publications please.
IF you indeed are quoting good history, you can find the academic sources to back yourself up!
Mary50
Word.
MichaelPG
1. Give a source for you accusations. If you're referring to the psuedo-scandal in which a charitable organization, whose stated purpose was placing muslim paiges in congressional offices, you're quite paranoid. The organization has been investigated and is only unethical or dangerous if you equate "muslim" with "terrorist." similiar organizations exist for christians and jews.
2. you are equating radical islamist regimes with the teachings of islam as if the former wasn't an interpretation of the latter. it would be like lumping the vatican, the branch davidians, the crusades, and bigamy all under a tent of "christianity" then claiming that christians can't be good congressman- just look at their history! and now they're defending christianity against these attacks! the rise of radical islam itself is partly a product of American proxy wars against the soviets. look up how many madrassas were funded by america during the 80's. radical islam is not a "natural" progression from the teachings of the koran- it was a state-funded ideology that has backfired horribly. actually islam had quite a long period of peace and religious tolerance even when it controlled jerusalem- of course that part is left out of conservative histories because it doesn't fit the narrative.
tyruler
LoL, attacks, ignorance, and reflexive hatred of Islam akin to the one of Ms. Torgerson would serve you well.
You talk about the history of Islam as if it were a rigid entity. Islam was arguable at its rise the greatest civilization of its time. At a time when you had the European barbarians including the ancestors of Ms. Torgerson, the Vikings killing, looting, and plundering everything in their path, Islamic civilization advanced in astronomy, preserved Greek philosophy, and created universities that are some of the oldest educational institutions in the world.
You talk about enslavement of Africans without mentioning the practice of enslaving amongst warring tribes was an African, not Islamic practice, though Islam did not outlaw it. Islam's Koran however is the only major world religious book to calls for its faithful to explicitly free the slaves.
And you conveniently don't mention that a great percentage of African slaves were West African Muslims from modern day Senegal, Ghana, etc. who were forcefully converted to Christianity by their European and American overlords. After all it wasn't Islam that was partaking in the colonial conquests and the transAtlantic Christian slave trade.
These are the straight facts, and quit trying to project you're hollow pseudo-intelligence on Islam by using various terms such as "Armani Islamist"
As Al Franken recently said to Mr. Thune, "You are entitled to your opinions, but not to your own (made up) facts."
Barbara416
America is sooooooooo screwed!
truthiness2
You are spot on.
However, some people are so eager to bash Christianity that are incapable of considering historical facts or current events.
TheRealFerrari
I'm pretty sure but correct me if I am wrong but historicaly hasn't Christianity had its share of unchristian like moments? Didn't the Christians kill and murder millions of people who didn't not convert or question the churches teachings? So how can we as Christians bash the Islamic faith and question every single motive of their beliefs and say they are unfit to lead a country that was founded on, and please correct me if I am wrong again, religious freedom.
truthiness2
Yes, Christians have had unchristian moments. Think about it though. You call murder, slavery, etc "unchristian moments". What are the tenants of Islam? "The spread of Islam was military. There is a tendency to
apologize for this and we should not. It is one of the
injunctions of the Qur'an that you must fight to spread Islam."
Dr. Ali Issa Othman, Islamic Scholar
Another way to think about it is: Study the lives of Jesus and Mohammet. Then when it comes to violence: ask what would Jesus do? What would Mohammet do? Who says "kill the unbeliever"?
What does a faithful Christian do? Do you know the parable of the good samaritan? What does a faithful Muslim do?
"O ye who believe! Fight those of the disbelievers who
are near to you, and let them find harshness in you,
and know that Allah is with those who keep their duty"
Qur'an, Sura 9:123
Teuthida
Anyone who firmly believes the tenants of Islam is unfit to hold elective office and make decisions regarding the common good.
But then again, I'd say the same thing about a Fundamentalist Christian.
jrcpdxor
Correct, but I'd go further and say that about any religion. If you garner any stance that comes from a book of religion good you are imposing on my right to be free from religion.
thebaker
That is a rather uneducated sounding statement.
JFKDem
You are all whacked. Straight nuts.
whipmawhopma
Yeah.
Wellington
I had to laugh reading what Keith Ellison said about stressing tolerance and invoking some of our Founding Fathers to buttress his point. In the Islamic world tolerance for non-Muslims is at a minimum. Why, in Saudi Arabia no religion is allowed except Islam. Christians or those of other faiths who preach their religion in Muslim lands do so at great danger to themselves. In Islamic religious law (Sharia) death is mandated for a Muslim who leaves his faith for another. Doesn't sound too tolerant to me. Perhaps Ellison should try cleaning up his own religion (which, quite frankly, I don't think is possible) before preaching about tolerance to others. Hey, Congressman Ellison, can you spell "hypocrite?"
jezoebel
Hypocrite. It's spelled T-o-r-g-e-r-s-o-n.
LivingInCT
Ellison doesn't live in the "Islamic world," moron. He lives in Minnesota and DC.
You're calling Ellison a hypocrite because he stresses tolerance while you're bashing him for all the bad things that happen in Saudi Arabia?
You're a typical Republican bigot.
truthiness2
He is not a hypocrite, he is just practicing "taqiyya" or "kitman". That is either lying or telling only part of the truth to "non-believers". It is part of jihad for when moslems are in a weak position and cannot impose sharia law.
Simpleton
Ellison is living in the US, not Saudi Arabia.
Saudi Arabia has close ties with the Bush family. And the Clinton family. So what?
You might as well associate Christianity with Uganda then, whether they are enacting laws to execute homosexuals.
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crypto
Anyone remember the internal wars in Northern Ireland. That may well be where we're headed.
Thank you.
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