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Top Talkers' Sham Truce
UPDATE: Truce? What truce? The New York Times published a front-page story on Saturday announcing a cessation of hostilities between MSNBC’s Keith Olbermann and Fox News’s Bill O’Reilly. As The Daily Beast’s Lloyd Grove predicted below, the peace agreement didn’t hold. It lasted just long enough for Olbermann to return from vacation for Monday night’s Countdown, in which he blasted the Times story’s author, Brian Stelter, O’Reilly, and News Corp. Chief Executive Rupert Murdoch as the “Worst Persons in The World.” For good measure, he called O’Reilly a “racist clown.”
Frederick M. Brown / Getty Images
The peace between Keith Olbermann and Bill O’Reilly is nothing more than a forced armistice. Lloyd Grove on why the slapfest will soon be back on—and why the two cable-TV megalomaniacs are essentially the same.
Xtra Insight: Plus, watch the best of the Olbermann-O'Reilly Feud
Judging by the hoopla surrounding the supposed truce between Fox News star Bill O’Reilly and MSNBC host Keith Olbermann—the Hatfield and McCoy of cable television—you’d think peace had broken out all over the planet.
A front-page story in The New York Times, no less, recounted a mid-May confab of corporate titans—Rupert Murdoch, chairman of Fox’s parent company, News Corp.; Jeffrey Immelt, Murdoch’s counterpart at MSNBC’s parent, General Electric; and, yes, Charlie Rose, Facilitator to the Famous—in terms worthy of the Yalta Conference.
If pressed to have a reconciling beer with one of them, I suppose I’d choose O’Reilly, who at least, on rare occasions, betrays a self-deprecating sense of humor. But I have almost come to think of them as the same person.
With Southern charmer Rose massaging the principals with his patented verbal balm, Murdoch and Immelt “expressed regret over the venomous culture between the networks and the increasingly personal nature of the barbs,” high-mindedly agreed to a cease-fire, and even shook on it, The Times’ Brian Stelter reports. “It was time to grow up,” an anonymous “senior employee” confided.
Maybe there’s something wrong with me, but I can’t get too excited about a forced armistice between two megalomaniacal cable-TV demagogues who really deserve each other. While I wouldn’t dare liken it to the Hitler-Stalin Pact—that’s the kind of overwrought sophistry best left to Olbermann and O’Reilly—there’s more than a whiff of self-serving opportunism in this image-burnishing deal.
Full disclosure: I am not an unbiased observer, having tangled with both as a gossip columnist over the years. To give them their due, they are both talented broadcasters (and very tall, each measuring in at well over 6 feet), and both have provided their respective audiences with some diverting moments of entertainment at 8 p.m.
If pressed to have a reconciling beer with one of them, I suppose I’d choose O’Reilly, who at least, on rare occasions, betrays a self-deprecating sense of humor. But I have almost come to think of them as the same person: Double O.
Olbermann’s impassioned and lengthy “special comments” about the outrages of the Bush White House, complete with angry glares and flying spit, were mesmerizing and occasionally informative; he is an accomplished writer and a facile ad libber. O’Reilly—who can be dour and distant in the flesh but lights up the screen with his magnetic persona—is a fearless interviewer. His incisive grilling of Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama were among the best TV interviews of the 2008 presidential campaign, peeling away layers of talking points to reveal each candidate’s core of grace under pressure. His more recent shouting match with Rep. Barney Frank—“You’re a coward!” he bellowed at the Massachusetts Democrat—was just plain riveting television.
Olbermann and O’Reilly also share some notable character flaws, many of them on public display. Both are surprisingly thin-skinned, unable to resist responding to the least little criticism with overwhelming force. I’d hear about it whenever I wrote something O’Reilly didn’t like, as occasionally my job required. Once he went on the late Tim Russert’s CNBC show, calling me a “weasel” and other such epithets in a five-minute rant; another time, according to a Fox publicist, he demanded that I be cut from the guest list of Fox News’ 10th anniversary celebration.
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Jacob Bernstein is a senior reporter at The Daily Beast. Previously, he was a features writer at WWD and W Magazine. He has also written for New York magazine, Paper, and The Huffington Post.
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Tina Brown is the founder and editor-in-chief of The Daily Beast. She is the author of the 2007 New York Times best seller The Diana Chronicles. Brown is the former editor of Tatler, Vanity Fair, The New Yorker, and Talk magazines and host of CNBC's Topic A with Tina Brown.
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Duff McDonald is a contributing editor at New York magazine and a former contributing editor at Condé Nast Portfolio. His book, Last Man Standing, about Jamie Dimon, chairman and CEO of JPMorgan Chase, was published by Simon & Schuster in October.
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Lloyd Grove is editor at large for The Daily Beast. He is also a frequent contributor to New York magazine and was a contributing editor for Condé Nast Portfolio. He wrote a gossip column for the New York Daily News from 2003 to 2006. Prior to that, he wrote the Reliable Source column for the Washington Post, where he spent 23 years covering politics, the media, and other subjects.
The All-New Sarah Palin
Lloyd Grove is editor at large for The Daily Beast. He is also a frequent contributor to New York magazine and was a contributing editor for Condé Nast Portfolio. He wrote a gossip column for the New York Daily News from 2003 to 2006. Prior to that, he wrote the Reliable Source column for the Washington Post, where he spent 23 years covering politics, the media, and other subjects.
The Boys Under the Bus
Lloyd Grove is editor at large for The Daily Beast. He is also a frequent contributor to New York magazine and was a contributing editor for Condé Nast Portfolio. He wrote a gossip column for the New York Daily News from 2003 to 2006. Prior to that, he wrote the Reliable Source column for the Washington Post, where he spent 23 years covering politics, the media, and other subjects.
a big difference between olbermen and o'reilly is that one is smart and the other is a dim bulb. guess which is which...
What a wonderful democracy we have when any boob can be a lofty Editor-at-Large.
I'd have to observe your body language in slow motion three or four times to figure it out.
Is this the new Rorschach test?
Both are obnoxious.
Would love to see a cage match.
Olbermann's a smug condescending angry tool,
with his "Special Commentary."
Who does he think he is ? Groucho MARXIST ?
O'Reilly is self absorbed, occasionally
injecting himself into the topics,
and what about those almost nightly T&A segments ?
Journalism ?
O'Rielly's T&A segments are to keep the goobers interested.
What a joke! This clown of a gossip columnist (who's not even in the same league as his subjects) writes a piece criticizing these two seriously successful commentators as if he's an equal. Like them or not (and I can't stand Bilo) they're both quite talented.
But to my point...
You can almost feel the jealousy oozing off the web-page as he describes them...He mentioned their height? What is that all about? I kind of got the impression that he might be attracted to these guys in a weird way...Either way, a wannabe (calling himself 'Editor-at-Large') who has the lack of vision to put Bilo in the same league as KO can't be very bright.
Bilo, like Rushbo, fuels the hatred of the far right and takes advantage of the ignorance of the uneducated. He rants and screams insults at anyone he doesn't agree with and often his arguments degrade to name calling and telling those he's debating to 'shut-up!'. Olberman may be self-righteous, but he makes sound arguments based in logic, he never name-calls and he's genuinely interested in what's best for America.
He name calls all the time! They even had a video posted on this very site not more than 4 days ago!!! I had to stop watching Olbermann after watching him every day for about 2 months because I couldn't stand how he just attacks and attacks and attacks....all I could see was O'Reilly's other half!!! And I despise O'Reilly! Hey, I'm a moderate liberal, just FYI, and any fool can see that these two are almost the same person, simply with opposite views and competing companies! This article is simply stating the obvious!!!
Grove should stick to the gossip columns. Nothing of substance here.
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here's the real story-- that the left and the right can get together to say "enough"-- you realize that there are no left and right-- it's just all one big happy corporate religion, bowing to the god of mammon-- and they give us this bone of "liberal and conservative" to bitch about
gotta love false equivalency...the you're a coward moment was riveting TV???
maybe the "gentlemen's agreement" wasn't between O'Reilly and Olbermann but rather between Fox news and the rest of the media promising not to expose them as the filthy Repubican propaganda machine that they are...and this is the opening salvo...FOX and MSNBC are the same thing...give me strength...its a if MSNBC didn't give Scarborough three hours a morning to indoctrinate and Buchanan appearances all day to spread racial fear mongering
Grove, show a little pride and fall on your own sword already
What a chuckle. The Him-Lloyd Groove calling O&O "megalomaniacs". Hello? Pot meet kettle and kettle.
Oh this article is crap and Billo back massaging.
Olbermann earlier said he'd quit talking about Billo do to his role in the Tiller murder.
But seriously KO is not self deprecating and has a thin skin?
Have you watched and interviews with him?
And have you seen Billo react to criticism?
Hell have you seen Billo react to play us out?
Come on you're defending a man who sexually harassed on of his producers.
Sends his other producer to stalk people.
Was surprised blacks in restaurants don't order by yelling where's my mfing iced tea.
Said u.s. soldiers deserved to be slaughtered during WW2.
Said women wearing short clothing deserved what they get in reference to a murder of women in New York
Called the father of a vet who died in Iraq a moron
and said that a kid who was kidnapped and raped enjoyed it.
You defended that human being sir.
Keith?
Excellent post. The best yet.
Right On Ronym5... O'Reilly is a disgrace.
Billo had nothing to do with "the Tiller murder". Some nut job did that not Billo. you must not like Billo, but I can tell by your comment you think highly of Olbermann, I personally think he should go back to ESPN.
I suggest
You go and watch
The numerous shows
That 'Billo' did on Tiller
Saying he was a baby-killer
Who 'needed to be stopped'.
That's blood-
And it's on 'Billo's' hands.
Insight blood lust and hatred against the Doctor for entertainment purposes
no less certainly helped create the climate that Emboldened a sociopath.
If you think not you are fooling yourself...
I see both of these men as clever political commentators. O'Reilly is part of the extreme right wing nutjob enablers. When Olbermann's comments begin spurring people to violence and civil disruption and he cheers them on, then he will be as low as O'Reilly. Until then: advantage Olbermann.
Thank you Ronym5, I could not have summarized it better
I agree. Very good.
Mr Grove, dear heavens O'Reilly a "fearless interviewer"? Really now, when has shouting people down been interviewing? Both of them are show men and I agree should leave your assistant alone. Trust me when I say that they are equally non-plus and people should be watching Rachel Maddow.
O'Reilly is hardly a 'fearless interviewer'. He attacked people on his show who were against the war as 'unpatriotic'. I was against the war and I AM as patriotic as Billo. Keith does rant sometimes but he is always truthful and he gets his facts right. None of this ''taking things out of context as is often done on Fox News.
I agree with the Rachel Maddow comment. She's one of the few actually worth watching.
Rachel Maddow is just as much in the bag for the Dems as Keith is. if anyone thinks any of these talking heads (Fox OR MSNBC) are really truthful or accurate then they are ignorant of their own bias. you all should try watching the *News* and stop getting your opinions pureed, prepackaged, and spoon-fed.
Yes but Olberman and Maddow actually quote sources They don't screech bigoted nonsense pretending it's information...
and how can all these "family values people" support this guy...who is a blatant sexual harasser of women...
It amazes me how some people think fox news is not in the bag for the GOP.
I DON'T SEE ANY NEWS ON TV THAT JUST REPORTS WITHOUT A SLANT
Watch the *News*? Full of 20-second sound bites? And focusing on Michael Jackson? Hardly a way of making informed opinions. You'd better check your own bias, deegeezee.
Today's TV news is a pale shadow of what it used to be. Not worth watching at all.
Rachel Maddow? Please. She is so biased she cant even turn her head to the right.
She's biased toward people with no logic, which is fine with me!
Maddow is amazing!! Such a breath of fresh air after putting up with "journalists" who just vomit opinions all over their cameras (KO and BO). A progressive, modern, witty, intelligent, polite professional is so rare!! She and Campbell Brown are my news goddesses. Way to go, ladies!!!
LLoyd says: "To give them their due, they are both talented broadcasters (and very tall, each measuring in at well over 6 feet)..."
I sense here an unrequited man-crush. "Keith was so mean to me...but, still, he's very very tall...and [fill in the blank]..."
The Os have one thing in common - they both dislike Lloyd Grove. Judging by the comments here, it looks like that's a large group.
LOL
You should have stated up front that you had been skewered as a "Worst Person." As for your producer, you might be a bit more forthcoming, were they an O'Reilly-stalker clone?
O'Reilly's slavish worship of the Cheney travesty was pure drivel. His role in the Tiller murder and subsequent non mea culpa afterward was the worst sort of journalism.
O'Reilly has high ratings due to the fact that he panders to the sickest and most unbalanced part of the American electorate - happily most of them nearing death from old age or advanced alcoholism. I would also guess that they live mainly in red states.
Equating Olbermann with O'Reilly is like equating Groucho Marx with Hitler. In spite of the silliness constructed by Groucho and his clan, they spoke a kind of truth. Hitler was, well, you know. O'Reilly has blood on his hands.
Well Said ! ! !
I wholeheartedly agree ! !
I like O'Reilly. I live in a Blue state, am under the age of 30, have never drank alcohol. Perhaps I'm still part of the sick and unbalanced American electorate?
i am so sick of hearing how conservatives are stoooppid. I am ivy league educated, catholic, (practicing) married 20 years (happily) and i am treated like a leper whenever anyone finds out my political leanings. What is wrong with liberals that you don't know your history? it was REPUBLICANS that ran the civil rights movement and implemented any and all changes for those in the minority status...check your textbooks quickly before they rewrite it! Abe and Teddy were our two greatest environmentalists! oh they were Republican, those idiots. Oh! Seriously, Robert Byrd has really done more for African Americans....oh that's right, he was a member of the KKK and oh yes, he REJECTED any and all civil rights legislation. HURRY read your text books before it gets changed. If you have any doubt, read Diane Ravitch and her book Censored.
Why are republicans no longer progressive then? They may have been so at one point, but that's history.
Who is this Grove person? Bill-O's side kick?
Olbermann and O'Reilly are the same except...
one is a perpetual liar, promoting fear and hate.
The other tells the truth, calls out liars, fear and hate mongers.
Badly done Grove..check your facts before you spew next time.
unfortunately neither show is much for fair and balanced reporting,, obermouth has a straight liberal agenda,,,,you never hear what obama doesnt want talked about,, ever hear them say send the illegals back? Nope, and billylips while usually not the aggressor sometimes is just plain ridiculous but at least has a oplinion on most everything even if its not fair and balanced. The whole thing is ridiculous and not in the best interest of the viewers but obermouths continual bashing of billylips and whatever else is just so childish and the ranting and carrying on is not necessary. The people really want fair reporting not continual rants and raves. Hear him rant about immagration? nope or some other ridiculous program, nope! and billylips puts his foot in his mouth all the time but least he has a opinion,,,,,,,then comes the ridiculous list,,,,, morning joesy,,,, who runs the show him or her? then foxes nut case,(cant think of his name) always lying and making stuff up,, then comes hardball,,,, god this guy if he isnt spitting on someone hes interupting everyone! On fox you have the wife of the guy who helped create our finacial troubles telling us how good he is, and fox well we all know they use the talking points for the rnc. Isnt it time for us to have some really good news,,,, no wonder its party first and the hell with the country,,,,, our news cant even be honest
You have some good points...except you miss the mark when characterizing KO as unwilling to call out the Obama camp. And that's a pretty big mark to miss. It's the fundamental difference between these two camps. (Well, that and the lying. And the fact that only one of these "news" networks hysterically calls itself "Fair & Balanced." Keith calls out Obama. Rachel calls out Obama. Chris calls out Obama. Ed calls out Obama.
Do you even watch Keith Olberman? He's criticized the Obama administration pretty severely, though admittedly for entirely different reasons than Bill O'Reilly and friends over at Faux News.
duanes said "The people really want fair reporting not continual rants and raves."
What a joke. People who watch cable "news" shows generally want their biases reinforced (in addition, of course, to being entertained). Fox News is especially good at spin, lies, and entertainment, but rather short on "fair and balanced" reporting.
Seriously? They're basically the same? Only where the pomposity ends. Olbermann doesn't pretend to be objective and dosn't give a shit what the other "side" thinks, which is why he doesn't have shoutfests with straw men, unlike O'Reilly, who clearly doesn't care about ANYTHING HE TALKS ABOUT. He just cares about being famous.
Sounds like a 'personal vendetta' Mr. Grove.
your false equivalency is phony and unconvincing.
(see edenscape24 and Ronym5, above)
The only conclusions one can draw from this shabby hit job are that you are petty, spiteful, and angrier at Olbermann than O'Reilly.
I agree.
It's so ludicrous to try to equate these two men. I have to laugh when I think of all the times I've seen O'Reilly simply scream and shout at a guest with whom he disagrees - or in many cases have their microphone cut off. What an obnoxious, insufferable bully. The whole Tiller thing.....O'Reilly has blood on his hands, without question. Just look at the YouTube clips and see the horrible lies he tells, the incitement is right there. O'Reilly is well aware of the deranged whack jobs who think he's great.
Why must I sign in every time I want to comment, even if I already signed earlier in the day? What gives? Why don't you recognize my 'sign in' permanently? This is getting old.
The biggest difference
Between them is that none of
The targets of Olbermanns's 'Worst Persons'
Has actually been shot
And killed.
Excellent point ---
Olbermann's "Worst Persons in the world" are identified and pointed out for the purpose of enraging the mob, otherwise why would he do it? Usually the worst persons are either a combination of O'Reilly, Hannity or Beck - sometimes all three on the same day. Even stranger is his obsession with belittling private citizens who have said something negative about the Obama Administration. Using his position to bully and intimidate private citizens and cheerleading the Obama Administration has to be a new low in a country that once respected freedom of the press and recognized the perils of expanding and over reaching government - MSNBC "journalism" = yellow journalism.
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That's only 'cause nobody watches Olbermann.
Seriously, you're going to blame O'Reilly for what happened to Tiller, just because he reported the facts? Tiller WAS a baby killer. What else can you call it? Maybe you'd have some ground to stand on if you say a 13-week fetus isn't a baby (I'd still vehemently disagree with you); but to take a baby that's full term, reach in and turn it around so it comes out feet first, then deliver all but the head before suctioning out the brains -- and to do this repeatedly -- and your beef is with O'Reilly for letting people know it's going on? What kind of sick bastards are some of you, anyway?
With this article, Lloyd Grove lets himself out the door as a serious journalist.
Keith Olbermann was a lone voice of truth during and after the Bush Admin. deceived this country into an illegal war that has murdered hundreds of thousands. Olbermann never pulled a single punch in contrast to almost every other so called journalist in America. O'Reilly doesn't deserve to even be mentioned in the same article with Olbermann.
This column is a sham and an example of the degenerate road down which the Beast seems to be going of late.
Glenn Greenwald covered this topic much more thouroughly in Friday's Salon.
Re: karen0117
I read that article and it is pretty chilling. I hope it gets a whole lot of attention. Thanks for giving it a shout out.
This "pox on both your houses" piece is nothing more than a biased missive. How could anyone want to have a beer with O'Reilly? Olbermann can be over the top -- but he's as smart as they come on cable tv.
of course, the "truce" won't last because feuds, even contrived ones, are good for ratings.
what i'm surprised about is how no one has commented on the new anchors at MSNBC. just in the past month, they have added 2 brand new and 1 re-shuffled host (ed shultz, dylan
ratigan & willie geist). guess what they all have in common?
they're all middle-aged white guys. i'm an MSNBC fan (and admitted pinko-liberal) but, jeez, are we still in the 1950s?
Let me say that when I hear something of interest, concern, of public attention, or political. O do some research on my own. I look up what Mr X supposedly said, and between the two of them, Mr O'Reilly is a liar, and Mr Olbermann is more truthful. Mr Olbermann has admitted on air, that he was wrong or made a mistake. Mr O'Reilly has always blamed the media, or someone else for his being caught in a lie.
For me there is NO COMPARRISON between the two. I'll take Mr Olbermann anytime or the brand X.
Now I also realize that most of the sheep who blindly follow Mr O'Reilly will disagree with me, but as I said at the beginning, I have them at a disadvantage, I look up the facts myself, and make my own conclusions as to who is telling the truth.
Hi Old Hippy,
I have listened to both Keith Olbermann and Bill O'Reilly. I was searching for truth. This is why I don't ever listen to or watch Bill O' anymore.
Bill O'Reilly should be made culpable for his role in demanding the death of the only physician in three states who helped women abort severely deformed fetuses - not just because they didn't want a child but because either the child is severely deformed or will be born with some other defect that will kill them possibly at birth.
I listen to Keith (and Rachel Maddow) every evening because they are far more fair and far more civilized and far more informative than Bill O' . I am saddened and disgusted that Bill O'Reilly has gotten away with calling for a murder - and then distancing himself from the crime because he had "nothing to do with it". He had so much to do with it. He should be questioned as an accessory - at least.
Mr. Grove, I will read your articles with enjoyment when I need more right wing garbage. This will put you in the same boat as Bill O and (naturally), the drug addicted chairman of the Republican Party, Rush Limbaugh.
Lemme guess.... you're an unhappy Republican???
Mr. Grove obviously doesn't know what unbiased means.
Mr. Grove is a schmuck.
Both men are arrogants (just like our President) and after
a few weeks of watching them I have given up listening to their "exalted" views. The best straigh-shooter in the nateworks at present is Lou Dobbs of CNN.
You're being sarcastic, right?
Or you're just a birther, which is even funnier.
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yeah sure......Dobbs the birther
Oh, THAT'S HYSTERICAL!! Speaking of "O" words, Lou Dobbs has OBLITERATED his credibility in the last two weeks. It's been kind of sad to watch, I have to say.
Perfect ratings ploy: Billo vs. Keith vs. Dobbs. Pay-Per-View cage match in prime time.
jrldev's not being sarcastic. He just hates immigrants.
They are NOTHING alike O'Reilly speacializes in bigorty at news Oberman counters the bullsh*t thats called news at FAUX. Apparently the writer would love to have abeer with his idol O'Reilly. Go ahead, your obviouly still hurting over Oberman calling you out as "Worst Person" alongside your "20 yrs old assistant". Go play with your friends the birthers and PUMA.
Could you tell me something that O'Reilly said (without taking it out of context) that is "bigorty"[sic]? I watch his show regularly, and certainly would not if I thought for one second he was a bigort. Or a bigot. Either one. And please don't trot out the restaurant line; it gets so old having to put that quote into context for people who aren't willing to check things out for themselves.
Let me get this straight:
Bill-O is a pervert and incredibly obvious liar who gets vicarious thrills taunting guests while manipulating both facts and logic yet, he's the same as Olberman? I suggest you visit both an Opthalmologist and an Audiologist. Then try again - OK big guy?
About the only things they have in common is that they are both air-breathing-life-forms and display a passion in their delivery. You seem (much like Bill-O) to dispense with facts, reality and reason while you spin your tome!
Me thinks you might try a re-write. Assuming you value credibility? Best of luck in your next job ;)
There's a big difference - Olbermann is Olbermann, while O'Reilly really isn't O'Reilly at all. O'Reilly is a mouthpiece for Roger Ailes and Rupert Murdoch who use the man to disseminate ceaseless, yammering lies and propaganda in furtherance of the Republican Party's agenda.
Propaganda needs to be countered. If it's not, you can end up with a President like George Bush. You can see a population essentially made to be demented and ready to go to war on phony pretexts.
Propaganda needs to be countered. And by the way, anyone who would like to "have a beer," with Bill O'Reilly is a complete dork anyway.
Olberman stopped talking about O'Reilly weeks ago - so why all this hoopla now? The big difference between the two is that O'Reilly is a liar and never admits he has said something false or tries to correct his errors. Olberman apologizes for his mistakes on the air.
Thank you.
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